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A Series of Facts on Contradictions in Quran « Thread Started on Jan 7, 2007, 9:05pm »
Part One of Series Apparent Bible Contradictions vs. Real Contradictions in the Quran:
I will be presenting a group of research studies contrasting apparent contradictions in the word of the true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, and Ishmael, creator of all there is, the Bible vs. real contradictions in the Quran.
This group of research studies will first deal with salient apparent contradictions in the Bible, and then follow with a group of research studies by the Quarnic scholar, Syed Kamran Mirza. Now let's concentrate on learning the facts with an open mind instead of a closed mind on all parts of this series.
Apparent Contradictions in the Bible Compared To Real Ones In The Quran and the Book of Morman:
It is high time that some start to realize that there are only apparent contradictions in the Bible, but when examined closely we find that these are all due to failure to comprehend what is being said, failure to understand the writing styles of the time the item was written, failure to understand the sentence construction of the ancient language, errors in translation, and biases on the part of the translator.
LET'S LOOK AT ONE EXAMPLE, MATTHEW 12:37-40 FROM WELL KNOWN:
"Then some of the scribes and Pharisees answered Him, saying, "Teacher, we want to see a sign from You." But He answered and said to them, "An evil and adulterous generation craves for a sign; and {yet} no sign shall be given to it but the sign of Jonah the prophet; for just as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the sea monster, so shall the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth." (New American Standard Bible; NASB)
"Then some of the Pharisees and teachers of the law said to him, "Teacher, we want to see a miraculous sign from you." He answered, "A wicked and adulterous generation asks for a miraculous sign! But none will be given it except the sign of the prophet Jonah. For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of a huge fish, so the Son of Man will be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth." (New International Version; NIV)
"Then some of the scribes and Pharisees answered, saying, "Teacher, we want to see a sign from You." But He answered and said to them, "An evil and adulterous generation seeks after a sign, and no sign will be given to it except the sign of the prophet Jonah. "For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth." (New King James Bible; NKJB)
"Then certain of the scribes and of the Pharisees answered, saying, Master, we would see a sign from thee. But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas: For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth." (King James Version; KJV)
APPARENT CONTRADICTION AND ITS EXPLANATION WITH REGARD TO MATTHEW 12:37-40:
Some see an error or contradiction in these scriptures related to the amount of time Jesus (Yeshua) was in the grave, but there is NONE. The true facts are: "Yes, it does seem that way. We must remember that the Bible was written in other languages by cultures far removed from ours. Most alleged contradictions stem from a misunderstanding of certain terms and phrases. For example, Jesus predicted that He would be in the grave for "three days and three nights"(Matt.12:40). When we read the passion narratives, we see that He was crucified late Friday afternoon and that He rose from the dead, early on Sunday morning. It is impossible to get three days and three nights out of this, and I have seen many atheists refer to Jesus' prophecy as a "blatant error which completely destroys the credibility of the Bible."[source - I'd Like To Believe In Jesus, But...By Bob Siegel , Published by Campus Ambassador Press, A ministry of Mission To the Americas Wheaton, Illinois]
To read the remainder of this specific research product, go to,
[read 1] Apparent Contradictions in the Bible Compared To Real Ones In The Quran and the Book of Mormon: at,
Part Two of Series Apparent Bible Contradictions vs. Real Contradictions in the Quran:
Contradictions in the Quran by Syed Kamran Mirza
And no question do they bring to you but We reveal to you the truth and the best explanation" (Quran 25:33).
1- Numerical Contradictions:
2- Creation of the Heaven and Earth
3- Sun-set and Sun-rise
4- A Resting Place For Sun!?
5- Why Allah Created Stars!
6- Is Sky/Heaven A ROOF or Canopy Over the Earth?
7- Does Sun Rotate Around the Earth?
8- Does Earth Spread Out Like Carpet (flat)
9- Is Man Created From Clotted Blood?
10- Is Religion Compulsive or is it not?
Prepared by: Syed Kamran Mirza
Special Note: Quranic ayats are taken mostly from translated Quran by Maulana A. Yousuf Ali and Maulana Muhiuddin Khan.
NUMERICAL CONTRADICTIONS
There are many numerical contradictions in the Quran. Can God make so much error in doing simple calculations?
How many days did it take to create Heavens and Earth ?
Quran 7: 54 Your gurdian-Lord is Allah who created the heavens and earth in Six Days
Quran 10: 3 Verily your Lord is Allah, who created the heavens and earth in Six Days
Quran 11:7 He it is Who created the heavens and earth in Six Days Quran-25:29: He Who created the heavens and earth and all that is between, in Six Days
The above verses clearly state that God created the heaven and Allah created the heaven and the Earth in 6 days. But the verses below stated-
Quran 41: 9 Is it that ye deny Him who created the earth in Two Days ?
Quran 41: 10 He set on the (earth) Mountains standing firm high above it, and bestowed blessing on the earth, and measured therein all things to give them nourishment in due proportion, in FOUR DAYS...
Quran 41: 12 So He completed them (heavens) as seven firmaments in Two days and ...
Now do the math: 2(for earth) + 4(for nourishment) + 2 (for heavens) = 8 days; and not 6 days
Similar mistakes you can see in the verse: Quran 4: 11 - 12, and Quran 4: 176 in inheritance law. In these verses one can see the total property after adding all distributed parties adds up more than the available property, i.e., totals become more than 1 which are: 1.125 and 1.25. How come ? A gross mathematical errors, is not it ?
Allah's Days Equal to 1000 Years or 50,000 Years?
Quran 22: 47 A day in the sight of the Lord is like a thousand years of your reckoning. Quran-32:5: To Him, on a Day, the space whereof will be a thousands years of your rekoning
Quran 70: 4 The angels and the spirit ascend unto him in a day the measure whereof is Fifty thousands years.
So, which one is it? Is the day of Allah equal to 1,000 earth years or 50,000 earth years?
Part Three of Series Apparent Bible Contradictions vs. Real Contradictions in the Quran:
Contradictions in the Quran by Syed Kamran Mirza
And no question do they bring to you but We reveal to you the truth and the best explanation" (Quran 25:33).
CREATION OF THE HEAVEN AND EARTH
Which one was created first? As you will see in the verses below, Allah at one time says that Earth was created first and another time he says that the Heaven was created first.
Quran 2: 29 It is He who hath created for you all things that are on Earth; THEN He turned to the Heaven and made them into seven firmaments (Skies)....
Quran 79: 27 - 30 Are you the harder to create, or is the heaven that He built? He raised the height thereof and ordered it; and He has made dark the night thereof, and He brought forth the morning thereof. And after that, He spread (flattened) the earth
Now, does it match modern science? Do you believe that, Earth was created first, after that, God created Heaven? Modern science tells us that? Or How come SEVEN firmaments (layers)? Modern science tells us that, actually there is no such thing Sky is no "roof" over us. It is only a space with no known boundary at all. These verses simply reinforce the ancient idea of ROOF over us which is called SKY, is it not so? How funny!
Part Four of Series Apparent Bible Contradictions vs. Real Contradictions in the Quran:
Contradictions in the Quran by Syed Kamran Mirza
And no question do they bring to you but We reveal to you the truth and the best explanation" (Quran 25:33).
This part consist of: 3- Sun-set and Sun-rise and 4- A Resting Place For Sun!?
SUN-SET AND SUN-RISE Koran teaches us that the Sun sets in a muddy spring:
Quran 18: 86 Till, when he (the traveller Zul-qarnain) reached the setting-place of the Sun, he found it going down into a muddy spring...
Quran 18: 90 Till, when he reached the rising-place of the Sun, he found it rising on a people for whom We had appointed no shelter from it.
Serious scientific errors here! Firstly, it is scientifically accepted fact that, the Sun never go down in a muddy spring. Secondly, this seems to presuppose a FLAT Earth, otherwise how can there be an extreme point in the West or in the East? A sunrise there would be basically just the same as at any other place on this earth, at land or sea. It would still look as if it is setting "far away". It does say, that he reached THE PLACE where the Sun sets and in his second Journey the place where it rises.
A RESTING PLACE FOR SUN!?
Quran 36: 38 And the sun runneth on unto a resting place for him. That is the measuring of the Mighty, the Wise. Quran 36: 39 And for the moon We have appointed mansions till she return like an old shrivelled palm leaf. Quran 36: 40 It is not for Sun to overtake the moon, nor doth the night outstrip the day. They float each in an orbit.
Allah is indeed a big scientist. Where is sun and where is moon situated? Can anybody tell me how they could collide/meet/overtake each other? Are the sun and the moon neighbors to each other? I have the answer for this error: Ancient Allah saw (bare eye observations) sun and moon traveling from east to west seemingly in the same Sky area or same path, without colliding, causing day and night etc. Allah hardly could imagine that all these phenomena are simply due to Earth's rotation and NOT by Sun's rotation. Sun is stationary for Earth, because earth is stuck in the sun's Gravity, like we are stuck in earth's gravity. Allah never says any where in the whole Quran that, EARTH ROTATES. Perhaps Allah could not feel earth's rotation.
A resting place for sun WAS CONFIRMED BY HADITHS?
Sahih Bukhari Volume 4, Book 54, Number 421 Sahih Bukhari Hadiths: Abzur Ghifari (ra) narrated: one day Prophet Mohammad (pbuh) asked me, "Abzar do you know after setting where does Sun go?" I replied, I do not know, only Allah's apostle can say better. Then Prophet (SA) replied, "After setting, the sun remains prostrated under Allah's Aro'sh and waits for Allah's command for rising again in the East. Day will come when sun will not get permission to rise again and Qeyamot will fall upon Earth".
Can anybody tell me what is it? It was the superstitious belief of ancient people reflected in the Quran and Hadiths by Allah. A 10-year-old boy would not tell such fairy tale story today.
Part Five of Series Apparent Bible Contradictions vs. Real Contradictions in the Quran:
Contradictions in the Quran by Syed Kamran Mirza
And no question do they bring to you but We reveal to you the truth and the best explanation" (Quran 25:33).
Part Five consist of 5- Why Allah Created Stars! And 6- Is Sky/Heaven A ROOF or Canopy Over the Earth?
WHY OLD MIDDLE EASTERN CELESTIAL MOON GOD, "ALLAH," CREATED STARS!
Quran gives us further scientific knowledge by telling us that the stars were created by Allah as missiles to throw at the devils:
Quran 67: 5 And We have (from of old) adorned the lowest heaven (sky) with lamps, and We have made such (Lamps as) missiles to drive away Satans...
Quran 37: 6-8 We have indeed decorated the lower heaven (sky) with beauty (in) the stars, (for beauty) and for guard against all obstinate rebellious Satans. So they should not strain their ears in the direction of the Exalted Assembly but be cast away from every side.
Thus, the stars are nothing but missiles to throw at devils so that they may not eavesdrop on the heavenly council. Once again we find how Allah was high on his superstitious weirdness.
IS SKY/HEAVEN A ROOF OR CANOPY OVER THE EARTH?
Quran 21: 32 And We have made the sky a roof withheld (from them). Yet they turn away from its portents.
Quran 31: 10 He hath created the heavens (Skies) without supports (pillars) that ye can see, and hath cast into the earth firm Mountains/Hills, so that it quake not with you; and He hath dispersed...
Quran 2: 22: Who has made the earth your couch, And the heavens (Sky) your canopy
Modern science tells us- whole thing around the earth is space and there is no boundary even if we go Billions of light years away in all directions. Questions are: When there is no sky above us then how in the world, it needs pillars for support? Do we really have a roof above us? Is there a canopy above the Earth? Is there anything called above or beneath us? Are mountains there to prevent Earth from shaking? Give me a break!
Once again Allah considered sky as roof over the Earth, which will broke/shattered during dooms day
Quran 78: 19 And the heavens (sky) Shall be broken (opened) as if there were doors opens...
Quran 82: 1 When the Sky is cleft asunder
Quran 69: 16 And the sky will be Rent asunder, for it will That day be flimsy (soft)
Quran 81: 2 When the stars fall, losing their luster.
Yousuf Ali comments in his Tafsir: beautiful blue-sky overhead (which we take for granted in sunshine) will be shattered to pieces. Modern science tells us that there is no such thing as roof/sky or any canopy over the Earth; rather all around Earth is a limitless space. Only Allah knows what will break/shatter or will get soft/flimsy or how doors will open , there is no walls, where from doors will come? In some Ayats Allah threatened kafirs by saying: "I (Allah) will throw broken pieces of sky over your head."
Part Six of Series Apparent Bible Contradictions vs. Real Contradictions in the Quran:
Contradictions in the Quran by Syed Kamran Mirza
And no question do they bring to you but We reveal to you the truth and the best explanation" (Quran 25:33).
Part Six consist of 7- Does Sun Rotate Around the Earth? And 8- Does Earth Spread Out Like Carpet (flat)
DOES SUN ROTATE AROUND THE EARTH?
Quran 31: 29 Seest thou not that Old middle eastern celestial Moon god, "Allah," merges Night into Day and He merges Day into Night; That He has subjected the sun and moon (to His law), each running its course for a term (time) appointed.
Quran 21: 33 It is He who created The Night and Day, And the Sun and Moon; each of them Swim (float) along in its own course.
Ayats mentioned above could be found over and over again and again almost in every pages of Quran. Because, Old middle eastern celestial Moon god, "Allah," standing in the open Arab desert saw very well that, every morning SUN is rising from the East and gradually (appointed time or fixed time) setting to the West, and as a result, day and night follows. Old middle eastern celestial Moon god, "Allah," truly mentioned this wrong knowledge (sun moving) of pre-historic people. Every time Old middle eastern celestial Moon god, "Allah," mentioned Sun & Moon, He mentioned day & night, as if it is due to sun's movement day and night follows. But surprisingly, all the hypocrite Mullahs giving false credit to Old middle eastern celestial Moon god, "Allah," by saying: look Quran told about sun's movement 1400 years ago which modern science only found out now. In real world, sun takes 225 millions of years to make just one complete circle through the solar Universe. And obviously this movement of sun has nothing to do with DAY & NIGHT of the earth. Actually, Sun is stationary in relation to the Earth, because the Earth is stuck to the giant gravitation force of the Sun, and the Earth also moves along with the Sun wherever it goes, just the way we are stuck to the Earth's gravitation force and do not feel its movement at all.
Why then, Old middle eastern celestial Moon god, "Allah," was telling the Sun's movement again and again. I have already mentioned above, why Old middle eastern celestial Moon god, "Allah," was hysteric about the Sun's movements. Now dishonest Mullahs are claiming science here. I wonder, why Old middle eastern celestial Moon god, "Allah," has to mentioned about the Sun's 225 millions year journey (which is even unimaginable to mankind) to tell about day and night? What relation Sun's movement has with the day and night?
DOES EARTH SPREAD OUT LIKE CARPET (FLAT)?
Quran 15: 19 And the earth We have spread out (like a carpet); set thereon Mountains firm and immovable;
Quran 78: 6-7 Have We not made the earth as a wide expanse, And the mountains as pegs (anchor)?
Allah was sure that earth is flat like a carpet and mountains are there to anchor the earth so that earth does not shake with us. Allah is really merciful scientist.
Your Friend in Christ Iris89 -
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Hi Everyone,
Part Seven of Series Apparent Bible Contradictions vs. Real Contradictions in the Quran:
Contradictions in the Quran by Syed Kamran Mirza
And no question do they bring to you but We reveal to you the truth and the best explanation" (Quran 25:33).
Part Seven consist of 9- Is Man Created From Clotted Blood? And 10- Is Religion Compulsive or is it not?
IS MAN CREATED FROM CLOTTED BLOOD? Quran-23:14: Then fashioned We the drop (semen) a CLOT OF CONGEALED BLOOD then fashioned We the Clot a little lump (foetus), fashioned We the little lump into bones, then clothed the bones with flesh, and then produced it another creation. So blessed be Allah, the Best of Creators. ( Bengali translated Quran said: "Zamaa't Raokto theeke Manoosh banieesi" And this Ayat has been repeated again and again throughout the Quran ) Quran-75:38: Then he becomes a CLOT; then (Allah) shaped and fashioned...
Quran 96: 2 Created man, out of a mere clot of congealed blood
There are serious scientific problems here:
Blood clot cannot grow into anything. This idea also came from the Greek. Aristotle erroneously believed that, humans are originated from the action of male semen upon female menstrual blood, which is absolutely an incorrect assumption. Quran's assertion on Clot (alaqa) is completely wrong about human development, since there is absolutely no stage during which the embryo consists of a clot. The only situation in which an embryo might appear like a clot is during a miscarriage, in which case the clotted blood that is seen to emerge (much of which comes from mother) is solidified and by definition no longer alive. Therefore, if ever an embryo appeared to look like a clot it would never develop any further into a human; it would be a dead mass of bloody miscarrying flesh. Since Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) had some thirteen wives it is entirely possible that he would be very familiar with miscarriages.
Modern science tells us that, the formation of human embryo is a seamless continuation from conception to birth; hence there are no hard- and- fast boundaries of stages as Quran describes. Quran describes 4 stages, which matches exactly with Galenic description of development of human embryo (which was proved wrong by modern science).
Creation of bones and clothing of bones with flesh: According to modern embryologists including Prof. Moore, the tissue from which bone originates, known as mesoderm, is the same tissue as that from which muscle (flesh) develops. Thus bone and muscles begin to develop simultaneously, rather than sequentially (as the Quran is telling us). Moreover, most of the muscle tissue that we humans have is laid down before birth, but bones continue to develop and calcify (strengthen with calcium) right into one's teenage years. So it would be more accurate if the Quran had said that muscles started to develop at the same time as bones, but completed their development earlier. The idea that bones are clothed with flesh is not only scientifically completely wrong/false, but was directly copied from the ancient Greek doctor Galen's hypothesis.
Also, the idea of saying: "made into bones and clothed the bones with muscle" came from the technique of making animal statue out of rod and cement or mud. People usually make the skeleton (out of rod or stick) first and, then cover it up with cement or mud. This is scarcely a scientific description of embryonic development. It is rather a description of an unlettered man.
IS RELIGION COMPULSIVE OR IS IT NOT?
Quran 02: 256 There is no Compulsion in religion....
OR
Quran 9: 29 Fight those who do not profess the true faith(Islam) till they pay the polltax (jiziya) with the hand of humility.
Quran 9: 5 Then, when the sacred months have passed, slay the idolators wherever ye find them and take them captive, and besiege them and prepare for them each ambush....
Quran 47: 4 When you meet the unbelievers in the Jihad strike off their heads....
Quran 2: 191 And slay (kill) them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out such is the reward of those who suppress faith.
Quran 8: 65 O Apostle ! rouse the believers to the fight of....unbelievers.
Very often apologetics claim that, Islam is a religion of peace and there is no compulsion. Yet punishment of an apostate in Islam is, of course, death penalty.
In very many Ayats Allah claimed that, He has given this Quran in the easy and clear language so that, it will not be difficult to understand by the ordinary Arabs.
Quran 44: 58 Verily, We have made This Quran easy in the tongue, in order that they may give heed.
No matter which translated Quran we read, the Quranic materials remain the same to us and every sentence is self explanatory and it does not take a rocket scientist to comprehend what is the message Allah wanted to transmit for Arabs. Yet, bigot Mullahs will always blame translators for Quranic contradictions/errors/inconsistencies etc. and will try to find lame excuses to cover up Allah's ignorance.
Comments: The Holy Qur'an is full of inaccuracies, contradictions, inconsistencies, redundancies, no chronology or chapters, grammatical errors, etc. One can find hundreds of contradictions/errors/inconsistencies in the Holy Quran. The above-mentioned Ayats are just selected samples from the Quran. But still it is a miracle to those who are blindfolded bigots. [source - Syed Kamran Mirza ]
Joined: Nov 2006 Gender: Female Posts: 2,203 Karma: 1
Re: A Series of Facts on Contradictions in Quran « Reply #1 on Jan 7, 2007, 9:08pm »
Part Two on A Series of Facts on Contradictions in the Quran
Hi Everyone,
Part Eight of Series Apparent Bible Contradictions vs. Real Contradictions in the Quran:
Additional Contradictions in the Quran by Quranic scholar, Syed Kamran Mirza
And no question do they bring to you but We reveal to you the truth and the best explanation" (Quran 25:33).
More Errors in the Quran - Section 1
But first a statement by Quranic scholar, Syed Kamran Mirza.
Are these any better? Look, my whole point of this is that I am tired of hearing how EVERY OTHER religious book out there is "wrong and has lies but the Quran is perfect" I see that no one stepped up to defend some of the other things that I posted.....like this (these aren't errors, I'll get back to those in a minute):
1. "Do not let non-Muslims enter mosques. They will go to hell." ( Repentance: 17 )
2. "O ye who believe! The non-Muslims are unclean. So let them not come near the Inviolable Place of Worship." (Repentance: 2)
3. "O ye who believe! Murder those of the disbelievers .... and let them find harshness in you." (Repentance: 123)
4. "Humiliate the non-Muslims to such an extent that they surrender and pay tribute." (Repentance: 29)
5. "O believers, do not treat your fathers and brothers as your friends, if they prefer unbelief to belief, whosoever of you takes them for friends, they are evil-doers." (Repentance: 20)
6. "Certainly, God is an enemy to the unbelievers." ( The Cow: 90 )
7. "God has cursed the unbelievers, and prepared for them a blazing hell." ( The Confederates 60 )
8. "Let not the believers take the unbelievers for friends.... whoso does that belongs not to God." (The House of Imram: 60)
9. "O believers, do not make friends with the Jews and Christians; ..whoso of you makes them his friend is one of them." (The Table: 55)
10. "The believers indeed are brothers." ( Apa rtments: 10 )
11. "Moslems are hard against the unbelievers, merciful to one another." (Victory: 25)
[[Note, exact quotes from 3 Qurans are being added to writings of Quranic scholar, Syed Kamran Mirza, to assist all in understanding his research product]]
What are some of those about? You aren't a good muslim if you are friends with a christian? If that is the case, how am I suppose to trust what someone is saying to me if I don't believe in their religion? It's kind of hard to "follow" something when it's telling me to "murder those of the disbelivers"
Oh well, like I said at the beginning of this......are these any better? I know a couple of them are the same but it's from a different place.
Error in the Quran
This article was written in answer to a statement that the bible contains error whereas the Quran, the muslim holy book, does not.
It highlights ten of the more difficult to explain contradictions within the Quran and will hopefully help get some of our muslim friends thinking, if you are a muslim I invite you to explain these contradictions and assure you that your refutations will be made public if this is what you require.
Please note however that I will not accept simple statements such as "you are wrong" as fact, answers must be supported by either convincing evidence or at least by a logical argument.
1) The Samaritan that never was: Surah 20:85-87 and Sura 20:95-97 state that the calf worshipped by the Israelites was made by a Samaritan but neither the country of Samaria (where Samaritans come from) nor the term Samaritan existed during this time (the time of the Exodus) and so it is historical fact that Moses could NOT have used the term or had any dealings with a Samaritan.
Sura 20:85-87,
020.085 YUSUFALI: (Allah) said: "We have tested thy people in thy absence: the Samiri has led them astray." PICKTHAL: He said: Lo! We have tried thy folk in thine absence, and As-Samiri hath misled them. SHAKIR: He said: So surely We have tried your people after you, and the Samiri has led them astray.
020.086 YUSUFALI: So Moses returned to his people in a state of indignation and sorrow. He said: "O my people! did not your Lord make a handsome promise to you? Did then the promise seem to you long (in coming)? Or did ye desire that Wrath should descend from your Lord on you, and so ye broke your promise to me?" PICKTHAL: Then Moses went back unto his folk, angry and sad. He said: O my people! Hath not your Lord promised you a fair promise? Did the time appointed then appear too long for you, or did ye wish that wrath from your Lord should come upon you, that ye broke tryst with me? SHAKIR: So Musa returned to his people wrathful, sorrowing. Said he: O my people! did not your Lord promise you a goodly promise: did then the time seem long to you, or did you wish that displeasure from your Lord should be due to you, so that you broke (your) promise to me?
020.087 YUSUFALI: They said: "We broke not the promise to thee, as far as lay in our power: but we were made to carry the weight of the ornaments of the (whole) people, and we threw them (into the fire), and that was what the Samiri suggested. PICKTHAL: They said: We broke not tryst with thee of our own will, but we were laden with burdens of ornaments of the folk, then cast them (in the fire), for thus As-Samiri proposed. SHAKIR: They said: We did not break (our) promise to you of our own accord, but we were made to bear the burdens of the ornaments of the people, then we made a casting of them, and thus did the Samiri suggest.
Sura 20:95-97,
020.095 YUSUFALI: (Moses) said: "What then is thy case, O Samiri?" PICKTHAL: (Moses) said: And what hast thou to say, O Samiri? SHAKIR: He said: What was then your object, O Samiri?
020.096 YUSUFALI: He replied: "I saw what they saw not: so I took a handful (of dust) from the footprint of the Messenger, and threw it (into the calf): thus did my soul suggest to me." PICKTHAL: He said: I perceived what they perceive not, so I seized a handful from the footsteps of the messenger, and then threw it in. Thus my soul commended to me. SHAKIR: He said: I saw (Jibreel) what they did not see, so I took a handful (of the dust) from the footsteps of the messenger, then I threw it in the casting; thus did my soul commend to me
020.097 YUSUFALI: (Moses) said: "Get thee gone! but thy (punishment) in this life will be that thou wilt say, 'touch me not'; and moreover (for a future penalty) thou hast a promise that will not fail: Now look at thy god, of whom thou hast become a devoted worshipper: We will certainly (melt) it in a blazing fire and scatter it broadcast in the sea!" PICKTHAL: (Moses) said: Then go! and lo! in this life it is for thee to say: Touch me not! and lo! there is for thee a tryst thou canst not break. Now look upon thy god of which thou hast remained a votary. Verily we will burn it and will scatter its dust over the sea. SHAKIR: He said: Begone then, surely for you it will be in this life to say, Touch (me) not; and surely there is a threat for you, which shall not be made to fail to you, and look at your god to whose worship you kept (so long); we will certainly burn it, then we will certainly scatter it a (wide) scattering in the sea.
The term was not used by anyone until around 722 BC, hundreds of years after the exodus that the "error free" Quran describes in this sura.
History proves without question that the term and the country did NOT exist until HUNDREDS OF YEARS LATER.
Would a perfect god make this blatant historical error?
Part Nine of Series Apparent Bible Contradictions vs. Real Contradictions in the Quran:
Additional Contradictions in the Quran by Quranic scholar, Syed Kamran Mirza
And no question do they bring to you but We reveal to you the truth and the best explanation" (Quran 25:33).
More Errors in the Quran - Section 2
[[Note, exact quotes from 3 Qurans are being added to writings of Quranic scholar, Syed Kamran Mirza, to assist all in understanding his research product]]
2) The miraculous journey: Sura 17:1 of the quran reads.... "Glory to Allah Who did take his servant for a journey by night. From the sacred mosque to THE FARTHEST MOSQUE".
Sura 17:1,
YUSUFALI: Glory to (Allah) Who did take His servant for a Journey by night from the Sacred Mosque to the farthest Mosque, whose precincts We did bless,- in order that We might show him some of Our Signs: for He is the One Who heareth and seeth (all things).
PICKTHAL: Glorified be He Who carried His servant by night from the Inviolable Place of Worship to the Far distant place of worship the neighbourhood whereof We have blessed, that We might show him of Our tokens! Lo! He, only He, is the Hearer, the Seer.
SHAKIR: Glory be to Him Who made His servant to go on a night from the Sacred Mosque to the remote mosque of which We have blessed the precincts, so that We may show to him some of Our signs; surely He is the Hearing, the Seeing.
The furthest mosque (arabic name of which is Al-Masjid-ul-Aqs-a) didn`t exist until AFTER Muhammed died, Muhammed COULD NOT HAVE VISITED IT!
Of course if this was added AFTER his death then it would have been easy to make such a mistake, but muslims are adamant the quran has not changed....
This verse is said to have been revealed around 622 AD but then the place the mosque, mentioned by name (so no doubting which mosque is meant), is at did not exist and indeed the place it now sits was in CHRISTIAN hands then and not muslim.
And no temple existed there either.
Muslims have attempted to say that the name is incorrect, that the name in the Quran ("the farthest mosque") must simply be another mosque with that name or that it refers to the temple (which of course we know didn`t exist then either) - anything they can rather than admitting that the quran got it wrong.
Part Ten of Series Apparent Bible Contradictions vs. Real Contradictions in the Quran:
Additional Contradictions in the Quran by Quranic scholar, Syed Kamran Mirza
And no question do they bring to you but We reveal to you the truth and the best explanation" (Quran 25:33).
More Errors in the Quran - Section 3
[[Note, exact quotes from 3 Qurans are being added to writings of Quranic scholar, Syed Kamran Mirza, to assist all in understanding his research product]]
3) Two of everything: Sura 51:49 of the quran tells us that....
"of everything we have created PAIRS that ye may receive instruction"
Sura 51:49,
YUSUFALI: And of every thing We have created pairs: That ye may receive instruction.
PICKTHAL: And all things We have created by pairs, that haply ye may reflect.
SHAKIR: And of everything We have created pairs that you may be mindful.
The quran claims to be from allah and here allah tells us that everything was made in pairs (incidentally muslims say they worship just one god, allah, yet here the quran says "WE have created" and not "I have created"?).
Guess allah didn`t make everything after all then, after all there is gravity which keeps us down - but no anti-gravity which pulls us up.
Bdelloid Rotifers (I`m not a scientist so hope I`ve spelled this right are a class of life that have apparently, according to the experts, been pair-less for millions of years.
I will not detail whole lists of things here that are not made in pairs such as certain types of plant, bacterium, etc etera as I`m sure most will know of at least one example and even one disproves the qurans claim.
Part Eleven of Series Apparent Bible Contradictions vs. Real Contradictions in the Quran:
Additional Contradictions in the Quran by Quranic scholar, Syed Kamran Mirza
And no question do they bring to you but We reveal to you the truth and the best explanation" (Quran 25:33).
More Errors in the Quran - Section 4
[[Note, exact quotes from 3 Qurans are being added to writings of Quranic scholar, Syed Kamran Mirza, to assist all in understanding his research product]]
4) Alexander the great - the muslim BEFORE Muhammed:
We all know of the infamous Alexander the great, he happened to think he was divine and had statues erected to himself among his historical achievements.
But did you know he was a muslim?
Surah 18 tells us of Zul-Quarnain, who muslims have always claimed is Alexander the great.
Sura 18:83,
YUSUFALI: They ask thee concerning Zul-qarnain. Say, "I will rehearse to you something of his story."
PICKTHAL: They will ask thee of Dhu'l-Qarneyn. Say: I shall recite unto you a remembrance of him.
SHAKIR: And they ask you about Zulqarnain. Say: I will recite to you an account of him.
And,
Sura 18.86,
YUSUFALI: Until, when he reached the setting of the sun, he found it set in a spring of murky water: Near it he found a People: We said: "O Zul-qarnain! (thou hast authority,) either to punish them, or to treat them with kindness."
PICKTHAL: Till, when he reached the setting-place of the sun, he found it setting in a muddy spring, and found a people thereabout. We said: O Dhu'l-Qarneyn! Either punish or show them kindness.
SHAKIR: Until when he reached the place where the sun set, he found it going down into a black sea, and found by it a people. We said: O Zulqarnain! either give them a chastisement or do them a benefit.
And,
Sura 18.94,
YUSUFALI: They said: "O Zul-qarnain! the Gog and Magog (People) do great mischief on earth: shall we then render thee tribute in order that thou mightest erect a barrier between us and them?
PICKTHAL: They said: O Dhu'l-Qarneyn! Lo! Gog and Magog are spoiling the land. So may we pay thee tribute on condition that thou set a barrier between us and them?
SHAKIR: They said: O Zulqarnain! surely Gog and Magog make mischief in the land. Shall we then pay you a tribute on condition that you should raise a barrier between us and them
According to muslims he was a great muslim, a follower of one god and apparently lived to old age.
Alexander the great, however, died at 33 years old after having put up statues to lots of different gods and even thought he himself was a god.
Clearly he was not a muslim, despite their claims, and he did not live to old age.
Another error?
Your Friend in Christ Iris89 - 88888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888
Hi Everyone,
Part Twelve of Series Apparent Bible Contradictions vs. Real Contradictions in the Quran:
Additional Contradictions in the Quran by Quranic scholar, Syed Kamran Mirza
And no question do they bring to you but We reveal to you the truth and the best explanation" (Quran 25:33).
More Errors in the Quran - Section 5
[[Note, exact quotes from 3 Qurans are being added to writings of Quranic scholar, Syed Kamran Mirza, to assist all in understanding his research product]]
5) The amazing tale of pharoah: We all know of the infamous pharoah and how he perished chasing after the Israelites.
But did you know that allah killed him and also let him live?
Surah 10:92 tells us that allah saved pharoah and let him live but the same story elsewhere in the quran (Suras 28:40, 17:103 and 43:55) say that actually pharoah drowned!
Sura 10:92,
YUSUFALI: "This day shall We save thee in the body, that thou mayest be a sign to those who come after thee! but verily, many among mankind are heedless of Our Signs!"
PICKTHAL: But this day We save thee in thy body that thou mayst be a portent for those after thee. Lo! most of mankind are heedless of Our portents.
SHAKIR: But We will this day deliver you with your body that you may be a sign to those after you, and most surely the majority of the people are heedless to Our
Compare with,
Sura 28:40,
YUSUFALI: So We seized him and his hosts, and We flung them into the sea: Now behold what was the end of those who did wrong!
PICKTHAL: Therefor We seized him and his hosts, and abandoned them unto the sea. Behold the nature of the consequence for evil-doers!
SHAKIR: So We caught hold of him and his hosts, then We cast them into the sea, and see how was the end of the unjust.
And,
Sura 17:103,
YUSUFALI: So he resolved to remove them from the face of the earth: but We did drown him and all who were with him.
PICKTHAL: And he wished to scare them from the land, but We drowned him and those with him, all together.
SHAKIR: So he desired to destroy them out of the earth, but We drowned him and those with him all together;
And,
Sura 43:55,
YUSUFALI: When at length they provoked Us, We exacted retribution from them, and We drowned them all.
PICKTHAL: So, when they angered Us, We punished them and drowned them every one.
SHAKIR: Then when they displeased Us, We inflicted a retribution on them, so We drowned them all together,
Now if there is NO ERROR in the quran then how can pharoah have died in one Sura yet not died in the others?
Joined: Nov 2006 Gender: Female Posts: 2,203 Karma: 1
Re: A Series of Facts on Contradictions in Quran « Reply #2 on Jan 7, 2007, 9:10pm »
Part Three on A Series of Contradictions in the Quran
Hi Everyone,
Part Thirteen of Series Apparent Bible Contradictions vs. Real Contradictions in the Quran:
Additional Contradictions in the Quran by Quranic scholar, Syed Kamran Mirza
And no question do they bring to you but We reveal to you the truth and the best explanation" (Quran 25:33).
More Errors in the Quran - Section 6
[[Note, exact quotes from 3 Qurans are being added to writings of Quranic scholar, Syed Kamran Mirza, to assist all in understanding his research product]]
6) Angels cannot disobey allah: Sura 16:49-50 says of the angels that "...They ALL fear their Lord, high above them, and they do ALL THEY ARE COMMANDED."
Suras 16:49-50,
16.49 YUSUFALI: And to Allah doth obeisance all that is in the heavens and on earth, whether moving (living) creatures or the angels: for none are arrogant (before their Lord).
PICKTHAL: And unto Allah maketh prostration whatsoever is in the heavens and whatsoever is in the earth of living creatures, and the angels (also) and they are not proud.
SHAKIR: And whatever creature that is in the heavens and that is in the earth makes obeisance to Allah (only), and the angels (too) and they do not show pride.
16.50 YUSUFALI: They all revere their Lord, high above them, and they do all that they are commanded.
PICKTHAL: They fear their Lord above them, and do what they are bidden.
SHAKIR: They fear their Lord above them and do what they are commanded.
Here we are told angels NEVER disobey allah.
But, not suprisingly, the quran then says in Sura 2:34 when talking of the angels being told to bow down to Adam that
"And behold, we said to the angels: `bow down to Adam`. And they bowed down, EXCEPT IBLIS. HE REFUSED AND WAS HAUGHTY".
Sura 2:34,
YUSUFALI: He said: "O Adam! Tell them their names." When he had told them, Allah said: "Did I not tell you that I know the secrets of heaven and earth, and I know what ye reveal and what ye conceal?"
PICKTHAL: He said: O Adam! Inform them of their names, and when he had informed them of their names, He said: Did I not tell you that I know the secret of the heavens and the earth? And I know that which ye disclose and which ye hide.
SHAKIR: He said: O Adam! inform them of their names. Then when he had informed them of their names, He said: Did I not say to you that I surely know what is ghaib in the heavens and the earth and (that) I know what you manifest and what you hide?
So according to the quran ALL angels do as commanded, but not always
UPDATE: In fairness to Muslims I have offered to show any problems found with the articles on Islam. One has written and been discussing with me this error in particular about angels disobeying allah.
As he rightly points out there is another Sura (Surah 18:50) which says the same thing but also says Iblis was a Jinn. Surah 2:34 however says ALL the angels bowed EXCEPT Iblis.
Sura 18:50,
YUSUFALI: Behold! We said to the angels, "Bow down to Adam": They bowed down except Iblis. He was one of the Jinns, and he broke the Command of his Lord. Will ye then take him and his progeny as protectors rather than Me? And they are enemies to you! Evil would be the exchange for the wrong-doers!
PICKTHAL: And (remember) when We said unto the angels: Fall prostrate before Adam, and they fell prostrate, all save Iblis. He was of the jinn, so he rebelled against his Lord's command. Will ye choose him and his seed for your protecting friends instead of Me, when they are an enemy unto you? Calamitous is the exchange for evil-doers.
SHAKIR: And when We said to the angels: Make obeisance to Adam; they made obeisance but Iblis (did it not). He was of the jinn, so he transgressed the commandment of his Lord. What! would you then take him and his offspring for friends rather than Me, and they are your enemies? Evil is (this) change for the unjust.
If the Quran is indeed error free this passage makes no sense as for all angels to bow except Iblis implies he too is an angel, if not then the command did not apply to him and so the Quran is wrong to say all angels except Iblis bowed.
The given answer to this, and one I cannot argue is wrong as I do not speak Arabic, is that the translations are in error and that the original Arabic language Quran reads in such a way that there is no confusion.
While I can`t confirm this without reading Arabic I felt I should add this possible explanation in the interests of fairness as I`m not here to mislead but to be honest. Basically the argument for explaining this difference is that the English translations are incorrect and that the Arabic version is the only one not.
Part Fourteenth of Series Apparent Bible Contradictions vs. Real Contradictions in the Quran:
Additional Contradictions in the Quran by Quranic scholar, Syed Kamran Mirza
And no question do they bring to you but We reveal to you the truth and the best explanation" (Quran 25:33).
More Errors in the Quran - Section 7
[[Note, exact quotes from 3 Qurans are being added to writings of Quranic scholar, Syed Kamran Mirza, to assist all in understanding his research product]]
7) Allah tells Moses about following Jesus gospel - 1000 years too early: The Injil (or gospel) is what muslims say was given to Jesus.
Jesus was born about 1400 or so years AFTER Moses.
Sura 7:157 reads "Those who follow the Messenger, the unlettered Prophet, whom they find mentioned in their own (Scriptures), in the Torah AND THE GOSPEL".
Sura 7:157,
YUSUFALI: "Those who follow the messenger, the unlettered Prophet, whom they find mentioned in their own (scriptures),- in the law and the Gospel;- for he commands them what is just and forbids them what is evil; he allows them as lawful what is good (and pure) and prohibits them from what is bad (and impure); He releases them from their heavy burdens and from the yokes that are upon them. So it is those who believe in him, honour him, help him, and follow the light which is sent down with him,- it is they who will prosper."
PICKTHAL: Those who follow the messenger, the Prophet who can neither read nor write, whom they will find described in the Torah and the Gospel (which are) with them. He will enjoin on them that which is right and forbid them that which is wrong. He will make lawful for them all good things and prohibit for them only the foul; and he will relieve them of their burden and the fetters that they used to wear. Then those who believe in him, and honour him, and help him, and follow the light which is sent down with him: they are the successful.
SHAKIR: Those who follow the Messenger-Prophet, the Ummi, whom they find written down with them in the Taurat and the Injeel (who) enjoins them good and forbids them evil, and makes lawful to them the good things and makes unlawful to them impure things, and removes from them their burden and the shackles which were upon them; so (as for) those who believe in him and honor him and help him, and follow the light which has been sent down with him, these it is that are the successful.
The quran makes it clear Jesus was given the gospel but here allah tells Moses that the people of that time could find Muhammed in Jesus` gospel - when it wouldn`t be knowen for well over another THOUSAND years.
The only way a muslim seems to find out of this one is to say it refers to the gospel, as we know, but that it is telling them it is yet to be revealed - unfortunately it is quite evident that allahs speech here is in the present tense to them, i.e. he is addressing them as if it already exists "WHOM THEY FIND MENTIONED" not "who they WILL find mentioned".
The incredible changing man: Did you know that allah created man, according to the quran from one thing.
[1] A blood clot (Sura 96:1-2).
Sura 96:1-2,
96.1 YUSUFALI: Proclaim! (or read!) in the name of thy Lord and Cherisher, Who created-
PICKTHAL: Read: In the name of thy Lord Who createth,
SHAKIR: Read in the name of your Lord Who created.
96.2 YUSUFALI: Created man, out of a (mere) clot of congealed blood:
PICKTHAL: Createth man from a clot.
SHAKIR: He created man from a clot.
[2] ....and water (Suras 21:30, 24:45 and 25:54).
Sura 21:30,
YUSUFALI: Do not the Unbelievers see that the heavens and the earth were joined together (as one unit of creation), before we clove them asunder? We made from water every living thing. Will they not then believe?
PICKTHAL: Have not those who disbelieve known that the heavens and the earth were of one piece, then We parted them, and we made every living thing of water? Will they not then believe?
SHAKIR: Do not those who disbelieve see that the heavens and the earth were closed up, but We have opened them; and We have made of water everything living, will they not then believe?
And,
Sura 24:45,
YUSUFALI: And Allah has created every animal from water: of them there are some that creep on their bellies; some that walk on two legs; and some that walk on four. Allah creates what He wills for verily Allah has power over all things.
PICKTHAL: Allah hath created every animal of water. Of them is (a kind) that goeth upon its belly and (a kind) that goeth upon two legs and (a kind) that goeth upon four. Allah createth what He will. Lo! Allah is Able to do all things.
SHAKIR: And Allah has created from water every living creature: so of them is that which walks upon its belly, and of them is that which walks upon two feet, and of them is that which walks upon four; Allah creates what He pleases; surely Allah has power over all things.
And,
Sura 25:54,
YUSUFALI: It is He Who has created man from water: then has He established relationships of lineage and marriage: for thy Lord has power (over all things).
PICKTHAL: And He it is Who hath created man from water, and hath appointed for him kindred by blood and kindred by marriage; for thy Lord is ever Powerful.
SHAKIR: And He it is Who has created man from the water, then He has made for him blood relationship and marriage relationship, and your Lord is powerful.
[3] ....and clay (Sura 15:26).
Sura 15:26,
YUSUFALI: We created man from sounding clay, from mud moulded into shape;
PICKTHAL: Verily We created man of potter's clay of black mud altered,
SHAKIR: And certainly We created man of clay that gives forth sound, of black mud fashioned in shape.
[4] ....and dust (Suras 3:59, 30:20 and 35:11).
Sura 3:59,
YUSUFALI: The similitude of Jesus before Allah is as that of Adam; He created him from dust, then said to him: "Be". And he was.
PICKTHAL: Lo! the likeness of Jesus with Allah is as the likeness of Adam. He created him of dust, then He said unto him: Be! and he is.
SHAKIR: Surely the likeness of Isa is with Allah as the likeness of Adam; He created him from dust, then said to him, Be, and he was.
And,
Sura 30:20,
YUSUFALI: Among His Signs in this, that He created you from dust; and then,- behold, ye are men scattered (far and wide)!
PICKTHAL: And of His signs is this: He created you of dust, and behold you human beings, ranging widely!
SHAKIR: And one of His signs is that He created you from dust, then lo! you are mortals (who) scatter.
And,
Sura 35:11,
YUSUFALI: And Allah did create you from dust; then from a sperm-drop; then He made you in pairs. And no female conceives, or lays down (her load), but with His knowledge. Nor is a man long-lived granted length of days, nor is a part cut off from his life, but is in a Decree (ordained). All this is easy to Allah.
PICKTHAL: Allah created you from dust, then from a little fluid, then He made you pairs (the male and female). No female beareth or bringeth forth save with His knowledge. And no-one groweth old who groweth old, nor is aught lessened of his life, but it is recorded in a Book, Lo! that is easy for Allah.
SHAKIR: And Allah created you of dust, then of the life-germ, then He made you pairs; and no female bears, nor does she bring forth, except with His knowledge; and no one whose life is lengthened has his life lengthened, nor is aught diminished of one's life, but it is all in a book; surely this is easy to Allah.
[5] ....and nothing (Sura 19:67).
Sura 19:67,
YUSUFALI: But does not man call to mind that We created him before out of nothing?
PICKTHAL: Doth not man remember that We created him before, when he was naught?
SHAKIR: Does not man remember that We created him before, when he was nothing?
Believe it or not there really are these FIVE different accounts of what man was made from.
Still no contradiction in the quran?
Your Friend in Christ Iris89 -
888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888
Hi Everyone,
Part Fifteen of Series Apparent Bible Contradictions vs. Real Contradictions in the Quran:
Additional Contradictions in the Quran by Quranic scholar, Syed Kamran Mirza
And no question do they bring to you but We reveal to you the truth and the best explanation" (Quran 25:33).
More Errors in the Quran - Section 8
[[Note, exact quotes from 3 Qurans are being added to writings of Quranic scholar, Syed Kamran Mirza, to assist all in understanding his research product]]
8) The magic inheritance: Suras 4:11-12 and 4:176 of the quran tell us the details of the muslim inheritance law.
Sura 4:11-12,
4.11 YUSUFALI: Allah (thus) directs you as regards your Children's (Inheritance): to the male, a portion equal to that of two females: if only daughters, two or more, their share is two-thirds of the inheritance; if only one, her share is a half. For parents, a sixth share of the inheritance to each, if the deceased left children; if no children, and the parents are the (only) heirs, the mother has a third; if the deceased Left brothers (or sisters) the mother has a sixth. (The distribution in all cases ('s) after the payment of legacies and debts. Ye know not whether your parents or your children are nearest to you in benefit. These are settled portions ordained by Allah; and Allah is All-knowing, Al-wise.
PICKTHAL: Allah chargeth you concerning (the provision for) your children: to the male the equivalent of the portion of two females, and if there be women more than two, then theirs is two-thirds of the inheritance, and if there be one (only) then the half. And to each of his parents a sixth of the inheritance, if he have a son; and if he have no son and his parents are his heirs, then to his mother appertaineth the third; and if he have brethren, then to his mother appertaineth the sixth, after any legacy he may have bequeathed, or debt (hath been paid). Your parents and your children: Ye know not which of them is nearer unto you in usefulness. It is an injunction from Allah. Lo! Allah is Knower, Wise.
SHAKIR: Allah enjoins you concerning your children: The male shall have the equal of the portion of two females; then if they are more than two females, they shall have two-thirds of what the deceased has left, and if there is one, she shall have the half; and as for his parents, each of them shall have the sixth of what he has left if he has a child, but if he has no child and (only) his two parents inherit him, then his mother shall have the third; but if he has brothers, then his mother shall have the sixth after (the payment of) a bequest he may have bequeathed or a debt; your parents and your children, you know not which of them is the nearer to you in usefulness; this is an ordinance from Allah: Surely Allah is Knowing, Wise.
4.12 YUSUFALI: In what your wives leave, your share is a half, if they leave no child; but if they leave a child, ye get a fourth; after payment of legacies and debts. In what ye leave, their share is a fourth, if ye leave no child; but if ye leave a child, they get an eighth; after payment of legacies and debts. If the man or woman whose inheritance is in question, has left neither ascendants nor descendants, but has left a brother or a sister, each one of the two gets a sixth; but if more than two, they share in a third; after payment of legacies and debts; so that no loss is caused (to any one). Thus is it ordained by Allah; and Allah is All-knowing, Most Forbearing.
PICKTHAL: And unto you belongeth a half of that which your wives leave, if they have no child; but if they have a child then unto you the fourth of that which they leave, after any legacy they may have bequeathed, or debt (they may have contracted, hath been paid). And unto them belongeth the fourth of that which ye leave if ye have no child, but if ye have a child then the eighth of that which ye leave, after any legacy ye may have bequeathed, or debt (ye may have contracted, hath been paid). And if a man or a woman have a distant heir (having left neither parent nor child), and he (or she) have a brother or a sister (only on the mother's side) then to each of them twain (the brother and the sister) the sixth, and if they be more than two, then they shall be sharers in the third, after any legacy that may have been bequeathed or debt (contracted) not injuring (the heirs by willing away more than a third of the heritage) hath been paid. A commandment from Allah. Allah is Knower, Indulgent.
SHAKIR: And you shall have half of what your wives leave if they have no child, but if they have a child, then you shall have a fourth of what they leave after (payment of) any bequest they may have bequeathed or a debt; and they shall have the fourth of what you leave if you have no child, but if you have a child then they shall have the eighth of what you leave after (payment of) a bequest you may have bequeathed or a debt; and if a man or a woman leaves property to be inherited by neither parents nor offspring, and he (or she) has a brother or a sister, then each of them two shall have the sixth, but if they are more than that, they shall be sharers in the third after (payment of) any bequest that may have been bequeathed or a debt that does not harm (others); this is an ordinance from Allah: and Allah is Knowing, Forbearing.
And 4:176,
004.176 YUSUFALI: They ask thee for a legal decision. Say: Allah directs (thus) about those who leave no descendants or ascendants as heirs. If it is a man that dies, leaving a sister but no child, she shall have half the inheritance: If (such a deceased was) a woman, who left no child, Her brother takes her inheritance: If there are two sisters, they shall have two-thirds of the inheritance (between them): if there are brothers and sisters, (they share), the male having twice the share of the female. Thus doth Allah make clear to you (His law), lest ye err. And Allah hath knowledge of all things.
PICKTHAL: They ask thee for a pronouncement. Say: Allah hath pronounced for you concerning distant kindred. If a man die childless and he have a sister, hers is half the heritage, and he would have inherited from her had she died childless. And if there be two sisters, then theirs are two-thirds of the heritage, and if they be brethren, men and women, unto the male is the equivalent of the share of two females. Allah expoundeth unto you, so that ye err not. Allah is Knower of all things.
SHAKIR: They ask you for a decision of the law. Say: Allah gives you a decision concerning the person who has neither parents nor offspring; if a man dies (and) he has no son and he has a sister, she shall have half of what he leaves, and he shall be her heir she has no son; but if there be two (sisters), they shall have two-thirds of what he leaves; and if there are brethren, men and women, then the male shall have the like of the portion of two females; Allah makes clear to you, lest you err; and Allah knows all things.
When a man dies, leaving behind three daughters, his two parents and wife, they receive respective shares of 2/3 for the three daughters together, 1/3 for the parents together and 1/8 for the wife which adds up to more than is actually possible
Example two is that a man leaves only his mother, his wife and two sisters, then they receive 1/3 , 1/4 and 2/3 [the two sisters, 4:176], which again adds up to 15/12 of the available property.
How can allah tell them this is how much each will receive when it adds up to MORE than 100% of what is actually there, it is physically impossible - if you are left three cars you can`t give five of them away can you (because it`s impossible)?
Part Sixteen of Series Apparent Bible Contradictions vs. Real Contradictions in the Quran:
Additional Contradictions in the Quran by Quranic scholar, Syed Kamran Mirza
And no question do they bring to you but We reveal to you the truth and the best explanation" (Quran 25:33).
More Errors in the Quran - Section 9
[[Note, exact quotes from 3 Qurans are being added to writings of Quranic scholar, Syed Kamran Mirza, to assist all in understanding his research product]]
9) Angels don`t protect, but they do: The last of these brief contradictions (it`s taken me a while to compile these so don`t expect another list just yet looks at the role of angels in the error free quran.
Suras 2:107 and 29:22 tell us that "Besides Allah you have no protector nor helper".
Sura 2:107,
YUSUFALI: Knowest thou not that to Allah belongeth the dominion of the heavens and the earth? And besides Him ye have neither patron nor helper.
PICKTHAL: Knowest thou not that it is Allah unto Whom belongeth the Sovereignty of the heavens and the earth; and ye have not, beside Allah, any guardian or helper?
SHAKIR: Do you not know that Allah's is the kingdom of the heavens and the earth, and that besides Allah you have no guardian or helper?
And,
Sura 29:22,
YUSUFALI: "Not on earth nor in heaven will ye be able (fleeing) to frustrate (his Plan), nor have ye, besides Allah, any protector or helper."
PICKTHAL: Ye cannot escape (from Him) in the earth or in the sky, and beside Allah there is for you no friend or helper.
SHAKIR: And you shall not escape in the earth nor in the heaven, and you have neither a protector nor a helper besides Allah.
But in Sura 41:3 the angels tell us that "We are your PROTECTORS in this life and the hereafter"
Sura 41:3,
YUSUFALI: A Book, whereof the verses are explained in detail;- a Qur'an in Arabic, for people who understand;-
PICKTHAL: A Scripture whereof the verses are expounded, a Lecture in Arabic for people who have knowledge,
SHAKIR: A Book of which the verses are made plain, an Arabic Quran for a people who know:
and in Suras 13:11, 50:17 and 82:10 we are told angels guard and later that they protect (Sura 82:10).
Sura 13:11,
YUSUFALI: For each (such person) there are (angels) in succession, before and behind him: They guard him by command of Allah. Allah does not change a people's lot unless they change what is in their hearts. But when (once) Allah willeth a people's punishment, there can be no turning it back, nor will they find, besides Him, any to protect.
PICKTHAL: For him are angels ranged before him and behind him, who guard him by Allah's command. Lo! Allah changeth not the condition of a folk until they (first) change that which is in their hearts; and if Allah willeth misfortune for a folk there is none that can repel it, nor have they a defender beside Him.
SHAKIR: For his sake there are angels following one another, before him and behind him, who guard him by Allah's commandment; surely Allah does not change the condition of a people until they change their own condition; and when Allah intends evil to a people, there is no averting it, and besides Him they have no protector.
And,
Sura 50:17,
YUSUFALI: Behold, two (guardian angels) appointed to learn (his doings) learn (and noted them), one sitting on the right and one on the left.
PICKTHAL: When the two Receivers receive (him), seated on the right hand and on the left,
SHAKIR: When the two receivers receive, sitting on the right and on the left.
And,
Sura 82:10,
YUSUFALI: But verily over you (are appointed angels) to protect you,-
PICKTHAL: Lo! there are above you guardians,
SHAKIR: And most surely there are keepers over you
So, in summary, the quran (which is claimed to be 100% free of error) tells us....
Allah made man from lots of different things, that you can inherit more than you are ever left with physically, that Alexander the great was a pious muslim, that someone corrupted the Israelites hundreds of years before he or his country came into being, that Muhammed went somewhere which didn`t exist until AFTER he died, that EVERYTHING is made as part of a pair, that pharoah died chasing Moses, that Moses was spared his life while chasing Moses, Jesus` gospel was really given by Jesus 1400 years before He was born and that angels never disobey allah - except when they choose to. [source - Syed Kamran Mirza ]
Re: A Series of Facts on Contradictions in Quran « Reply #3 on Jan 10, 2007, 3:05am »
WORD REPETITIONS IN THE QUR'AN
Apart from the miraculous characteristics of the Qur’an, which we have looked into so far, it also contains a "mathematical miracle". One example of this is the number of repetitions of certain words in the Qur'an. Some related words are surprisingly repeated the same number of times. Below is a list of such words and the number of repetitions in the Qur'an.
The statement of "seven heavens" is repeated seven times. "The creation of the heavens (khalq as-samawat)" is also repeated seven times.
"Day (yawm)" is repeated 365 times in singular form, while its plural and dual forms "days (ayyam and yawmayn)" together are repeated 30 times. The number of repetitions of the word "month" (shahar) is 12.
"Treachery" (khiyanah) is repeated 16 times, while the number of repetitions of the word "foul" (khabith) is 16. The number of repetitions of the words "plant" and "tree" is the same: 26 The word "payment or reward" is repeated 117 times, while the expression "forgiveness" (mughfirah), which is one of the basic principles of the Qur'an, is repeated exactly twice that amount, 234 times.
When we count the word "Say", we find it appears 332 times. We arrive at the same figure when we count the word "they said". The number of times the words, "world" (dunya) and "hereafter" (akhira) are repeated is also the same: 115 The word "satan" (shaitan) is used 88 times, as is the word "angels" (malaika). The words "paradise" and "hell" are each repeated 77 times. The word "zakah" is repeated 32 times, and the number of repetitions of the word "blessing" (barakah) is also 32. The expression "the righteous" (al-abraar) is used 6 times, but "the wicked" (al-fujjaar) is used half as much, i.e., 3 times. The number of times the words "Summer-hot" and "winter-cold" are repeated is the same: 5. The words "wine" (khamr) and "intoxication" (saqara) are repeated the same number of times: 6 "Wealth" is repeated 26 times, but "poverty", on the other hand, half as much, that is, 13 times. The words "tongue" and "sermon" are both repeated 25 times. The words "benefit" and "corrupt" both appear 50 times. "Reward" (ajr) and "action" (fail) are both repeated 108 times. The words "disaster" (al-musibah) and "thanks" (al-shukr) appear the same number of times in the Qur'an: 75. "Love" (al-mahabbah) and "obedience" (al-ta'ah) also appear the same number of times: 83. The word "facility, relief" (al-yisr) appears exactly three times more often than the word "difficulty" (al-'usr). "Hardship" (al-shiddah) and "patience" (al-sabr) both appear 115 times. The words "man" and "woman" are also employed equally: 23 times. "Sun" (shams) and "light" (nur) both appear 33 times in the Qur'an. "Human being" is used 65 times: the sum of the number of references to the stages of man's creation is the same: i.e. Soil (turab) 17 Drop of Sperm (nutfah) 12 Embryo ('alaq) 6 A half formed lump of flesh (mudghah) 3 Bone ('idham) 15 Flesh (lahm) 12 TOTAL 65
The word "salawat" appear five times in the Qur'an, and Allah has commanded man to perform the salat five times a day.
The word "land" appears 13 times in the Qur’an, and the word "sea" 32 times, giving a total of 45 references. If we divide that number by that of the number of references to the land we arrive at the figure 28.8888889%. The number of total references to land and sea, 45, divided by the number of references to the sea in the Qur’an, 32, is 71.111111%. These figures represent the exact proportions of land and sea on the earth today
Re: A Series of Facts on Contradictions in Quran « Reply #5 on Jun 28, 2007, 7:08pm »
Quote:
Or How come SEVEN firmaments (layers)? Modern science tells us that, actually there is no such thing Sky is no "roof" over us. It is only a space with no known boundary at all. These verses simply reinforce the ancient idea of ROOF over us which is called SKY, is it not so? How funny!
Who's science are you reading??? We have a little something called the ozone layer... IF there was not barrier the sun would burn us to ashes....
Joined: Nov 2006 Gender: Female Posts: 2,203 Karma: 1
Re: A Series of Facts on Contradictions in Quran « Reply #6 on Jun 29, 2007, 8:56am »
Hi inluvwitgod
You are overlooking the fact that the Quran is nothing but a distorted Bible knockoff of the Bible that was thoroughly trashed by Caliph Uthman early on. for details, check out,
[go to] The Quran Corrupted From The Beginning by Caliph Uthman: at,
And as we all know any distorted copy of anything has at least 10 times more error than the original.
Let's look at some facts.
Book Review Shows Quran A Knockoff of The Bible
INTRODUCTION:
A book review of Christoph Luxenberg, a world renown linguistic scholar, clearly reveals that the Quran is nothing but a distorted knockoff of the inspired word of the true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, and Ishmael, creator of all there is, the Bible.
This book review is contained in, "HUGOYE: JOURNAL OF SYRIAC STUDIES," book review of Christoph Luxenberg (ps.) Die syro-aramaeische Lesart des Koran; Ein Beitrag zur Entschlüsselung der Qur'ansprache. Berlin, Germany: Das Arabische Buch, First Edition, 2000. Pp. ix + 306, Vol. 6, No. 1, January 2003. [http://syrcom.cua.edu/Hugoye/Vol6No1/HV6N1PRPhenixHorn.html ]
THE EVIDENCE:
Let's look at the evidence contained in the book review of Christoph Luxenberg's latest book in German, "Die syro-aramaeische Lesart des Koran; Ein Beitrag zur Entschlüsselung der Qur'ansprache." He clearly shows that the Quran draws on personal names of Biblical origins, that the name "Quran' even indicates its origin, that it was NEVER intended to replace the written source - the Bible, that it was distorted from the writings of Muhammad early on, as follows:
<<<"The rest of the section draws on personal names of Biblical origin in the Qur'an to demonstrate that the so-called Arabic matres lectionis, 'alif, waw, and ya, must also be polyvalent. Luxenberg points out that Islamic tradition admits a reading of the mater for long /a/ in certain instances as /e/ because this pronunciation was a peculiarity of the Arabic of Mecca. Luxenberg shows that the term harf, "sign" must also carry a meaning synonymous to qira'at, "(way of) reading" and that this is not only supplying the vowels in an unvocalized text, but also supplying the diacritical points that distinguish consonants. It is only gradually that these diacritical points became fixed so that consonants came to have just one reading. This process of determining the value of each letter of the Qur'an unfolded over some three hundred years. This is known from the oldest manuscripts of the Qur'an which do not have the diacritical points distinguishing readings of a single consonant. By the time these became commonly used, Arabian commentators were no longer aware that many words were either straight Aramaic or were calques peculiar to Meccan Arabic. From this resulted the difficulties that the Qur'an posed to even the earliest Arabian commentators...
The section concludes by demonstrating that the technical meaning of "lectionary" is preserved in the word qur'an. Most striking is the conclusion that the term umm kitab, an aramaism, must be a written source and that the Qur'an was never intended to replace this written source. One might complain that the details of the argument for the reading of suras 12:1-2 and 3:7 are squeezed into footnotes, but nevertheless the argument is clear. Luxenberg proves that the term qur'an itself is the key to unlocking the passages that have given commentators in and outside of the tradition frustration. If quryan means "lectionary," and if the text itself claims to be a clarification of an earlier text, then that earlier text must be written in another language. The only candidate is the Old and New Testament in Syriac, the Penutsta. Hence the influence of Aramaic on the Arabic of Muhammad has an identifiable, textual origin. At the very end of the work, Luxenberg makes a compelling argument that sura 108 is a close allusion to the Penutsta of 1 Peter 5:8-9. Indeed this sura, which is only three lines long, is one of the most difficult passages for the Arabian as well as the Western commentators. Luxenberg shows why: it is composed of transcriptions into Arabic writing of the Syriac New Testament text, i.e., there is almost no "Arabic" in the sura. These are "revealed" texts, and insofar as the Qur'an contains quotations or paraphrases of them, the Qur'an is also "revealed." ...
Many dialects of Arabic existed at the time of Muhammad. In the ten places where the Qur'an claims to have been written in Arabic, Luxenberg shows first that these passages have grammatical forms which are difficult for the commentators and have varying interpretations among the translators. He notes that in sura 41:44, the Arabic fassala means "to divide," but the context here requires "make distinct" or better "interpret." Nowhere else does the Arabic word have this meaning, and the Syriac-Arabic lexica do not give the one as a translation for the other; tarjama (a direct borrowing from Syriac) is the usual Arabic word for "interpret." However, the Syriac praš / parreš can mean both "divide" as well as "interpret" (like Hebrew hibdil; also this is an example of a "semantic calque" mentioned above). Tabari too understands fassala to be a synonym for bayyana (sura 44:3), which also has the meaning "interpret." Sura 41:44 also clearly attests to a source for the Qur'an that is written in a foreign language. Luxenberg, following Tabari, notes a corruption in the text of this verse that clearly shows that part of the Qur'an has a non-Arabic source. His argument here is somewhat weak if not for the further evidence deduced from eleven other locations in the Qur'an where Luxenberg consistently applies these and similar arguments to difficulties all of which center on the terms related to the revelation and language of the Qur'an. These arguments leave little doubt, that Luxenberg has uncovered a key misunderstanding of these terms throughout the Qur'an....
In section twelve Luxenberg demonstrates that not only the origin and language of the Qur'an are different from what the commentators who wrote two hundred years after its inception claim it to be, but that several key passages contain words or idioms that were borrowed from Syriac into Arabic. From his analysis of sura 19:24 (in the so-called "Marian Sura"): "Then he called to her from beneath her: 'Grieve not; thy Lord hath placed beneath thee a streamlet,'" he concludes that it should be read "He called to her immediately after her laying-down (to give birth 'Grieve not; thy Lord has made your laying-down legitimate.'" Luxenberg's lengthy discussion of the complexities of this passage resolve grammatical difficulties in the Arabic in a way that fits the context: Jesus gives Mary the courage to face her relatives even with a child born out of wedlock. The section then presents lengthy arguments dealing with various lexical, morphological, syntactic and versification problems in sura 11:116-117...
In that same section, one also finds a study of how Syriac roots were misread and altered by later commentators. In one case, the word jaw (sura 16:79) misread "air, atmosphere" is from Syriac gaw, which means both "insides, inner part" and can also be used as a preposition meaning "inside." In sura 16:79 Luxenberg demonstrates that the prepositional use makes more sense than the solution posed by the commentators. Classical Arabic grammar, which was created three hundred years after the Qur'an, does not recall the prepositional meaning of the word. However, dialects of Arabic preserve the original Syriac prepositional use. So where sura 16:79 reads fi jaw as-sama' "in(side) heaven" referring to birds held aloft and kept from falling down by God, the dialects agree: fi jawwat al-bet "inside the house" is perfectly good Arabic. The misreading of Qur'anic Arabic jaw as "air" has become part of the technical vocabulary of modern standard Arabic: "air mail," "air force," "airline," and "weather report" all use jaw. The imaginary meaning of the grammarians lives on. ...
Section sixteen follows this investigation as it points to a similar misreading of paradise's grapes as youths, Arabic wildun. Sura 76:19 "Round amongst them go boys of perpetual youth, whom when one see, he thinks them pearls unstrung" (sura 16.1, citing Bell's translation). Wildun is a genuinely Arabic word, but it is used in a sense which is borrowed from Syriac yalda. Youths like pearls is somewhat suspicious, especially given that "pearls" are a metaphor for the grapes of paradise from the previous section. Luxenberg uncovered that Syriac has the expression yalda dagpetta, "child of the vine," appearing in the Penutsta: Matthew 26:29, Mark 14:25, and Luke 22:18, in which Christ foreshadows his death and resurrection: "I will not drink of this child of the vine (yalda dagpetta) until the day when I drink it new in the kingdom of my Father." Here it is the juice of the grape that is the "child." Entries in the Arabic-Syriac lexica for each of yalda and gpetta give in addition to "child" and "vine" "fruit" and "wine," respectively. Luxenberg gives further evidence from suras 37:45, 43:71, and 76:15 that Ephraem the Syrian's depiction of the grapes of paradise is behind the original Qur'anic text.
A central question that this investigation raises is the motivation of cUthman in preparing his redaction of the Qur'an. Luxenberg presents the two hadith traditions recounting how cUthman came to possess the first manuscript. If Luxenberg's analysis is even in broad outline correct, the content of the Qur'an was substantially different at the time of Muhammad and cUthman's redaction played a part in the misreading of key passages. Were these misreadings intentional or not? The misreadings in general alter the Qur'an from a book that is more or less harmonious with the New Testament and Syriac Christian liturgy and literature to one that is distinct, of independent origin. " [source - book review is contained in, "HUGOYE: JOURNAL OF SYRIAC STUDIES," book review of Christoph Luxenberg (ps.) Die syro-aramaeische Lesart des Koran; Ein Beitrag zur Entschlüsselung der Qur'ansprache. Berlin, Germany: Das Arabische Buch, First Edition, 2000. Pp. ix + 306, Vol. 6, No. 1, January 2003.]>>>.
CONCLUSION:
The inescapable conclusion is that Muhammad (pbuh) used the inspired word of the true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, and Ishmael, creator of all there is, as his guide without giving credit to the source which is called plagiarism, and that at a later date, the Quran was corrupted by those who did not fully comprehend the specific dialect it was written in.
To learn even more with respect the Quran just being a distorted Bible knockoff, go to the following,
[1] Apparent Contradictions in the Bible Compared To Real Ones In The Quran and the Book of Mormon: at,
Re: A Series of Facts on Contradictions in Quran « Reply #7 on Jul 2, 2007, 11:59am »
Iris, your last post has nothing to do with my reply. You claim that there is no barrier or layers between us and outerspace but you are mistaken... the Quran is correct. There is a layer of protection between us and the sun. If it wasn't there we would burn up and this planet would be uninhabitable.
Joined: Nov 2006 Gender: Female Posts: 2,203 Karma: 1
Re: A Series of Facts on Contradictions in Quran « Reply #8 on Jul 2, 2007, 12:18pm »
Hi inluvwitgod
You are just plain "nutty" as I have made no such claim as you allege:
Quote:
Iris, your last post has nothing to do with my reply. You claim that there is no barrier or layers between us and outerspace but you are mistaken... the Quran is correct. There is a layer of protection between us and the sun. If it wasn't there we would burn up and this planet would be uninhabitable.
You are way off topic as this thread is about "A Series of Facts on Contradictions in Quran" not barrier layers such as the Ozonosphere, so get back on topic. This is a forum on religion, not science, remember.
Your Friend in Christ Iris89
You are way off topic as this thread is about "A Series of Facts on Contradictions in Quran" not barrier layers such as the Isonsphere, so get back on topic.
Re: A Series of Facts on Contradictions in Quran « Reply #9 on Jul 2, 2007, 2:41pm »
This is one of the "contradictions" you claim against the Quran but you are in fact incorrect about this and the Quran does not contradict nature or science in anyway. You are the one trying to prove the Quran wrong by science so I am right on topic thank you.
Joined: Nov 2006 Gender: Female Posts: 2,203 Karma: 1
Re: A Series of Facts on Contradictions in Quran « Reply #10 on Jul 2, 2007, 7:02pm »
Hi inluvwitgod
Discussion is one thing, but assertion of something already shown as wrong is quite another. Discussion should be to bring out the facts, but not to ‘bull headedly’ push something that is just plain wrong such as saying that mythical god, the old middle eastern celestial Moon god, "Allah," who only exist in the imaginations of deceived men, but has no physical existance, and the true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Issac, Ishmael, Noah, Moses, etc., the creator of all there is, Almighty God (YHWH) are one and the same after this has been shown as untrue.
Let’s visit the facts once more and end this with the only logical conclusion that they are NOT THE SAME:
FIRST, PROBLEM, Many do not know who Almighty God (YHWH) is and ascribe him to other gods, a wicked act.
For example, some say he is Baal, Chemash, Allah, etc. But the fact he is none of these, he is the true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, Ishmael, and Jacob, creator of all there is, which is even acknowledged by some in Islam as follows:
And learn the truth per John 8:32, "And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free" (Authorized King James Bible; AV), and then, become a genuine (true) Christian a true follower of Jesus (Yeshua) Christ, the Son of the true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, and Ishmael, creator of all there is whom you pointed out is NOT THE GOD YOU FOLLOW. Let's look at what Another member of Islam said in the past.
Quote:
that we worship a different god
Go research the subject and you will see I am absolutely correct. A member of Islam has even admitted that fact as follows:
Quote:
Quote:
[[My comment on your untrue statement.]] You made a dumb statement that denies reality and even what you said in the past, [[Your statement, a member of Islam ]] Quote:
Jesus is never been crucified
[[My comment on your untrue statement.]] Which is both untrue and you well know it, as you previously said, [[Your statement, a member of Islam ]] Quote:
I will not accept a god that is not able to save his own son.
[[My comment on your untrue statement.]] So you have knowingly told an untruth and you know what that makes you, so stop being in a state of denial and become a genuine (true) Christian.
[/quote] \
And another Muslim said the following also admitting that "Allah," is not the true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, Ishmael, and Jacob, creator of all there is,
Quote:
First of all - the idiot Talmudi Zionist doesn't know that Islam doesn't call THE CREATOR - 'a true God' - but calls Him Allah - Who has 99 additional Divine Attributes (unique characteristics) - while Zionist's 'the true God' could be a 'monkey' - as Hindus believe!
Second - Muslims, like Christians - believe that the 'Jewish promised Messiah' had arrived 2000 years ago - prophet Jesus (as) - but the Jews rejected him and are still waiting for the arrival of a 'Jewish Messiah' - though Zionists believe that Theodor Herzl was 'the promised Jewish Messiah'.
For more information, go to,
[1] The Fact on The Name "Allah" at,http://religioustruths.proboards59.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=allah&thread=1163516614
[2] Who Really Is 'Allah' The Supreme God Of The Makkans [Residents of Ancient Mecca] at,
SECOND, Now let’s look at renown historical records:
<<<"It should not come as a surprise that the word "Allah" was not something invented by Muhammad or revealed for the first time in the Quran.
The well-known Middle East scholar H.A.R. Gibb has pointed out that the reason that Muhammad never had to explain who Allah was in the Quran is that his listeners had already heard about Allah long before Muhammad was ever born" [source - Mohammedanism: An Historical Survey, New York: Mentor Books, 1955, p.38]>>>.
<<<"Dr. Arthur Jeffery, one of the foremost Western Islamic scholars in modern times and professor of Islamic and Middle East Studies at Columbia University, notes:
"The name Allah, as the Quran itself is witness, was well known in pre-Islamic Arabia. Indeed, both it and its feminine form, Allat, are found not infrequently among the theophorous names in inscriptions from North Africa" (Islam: Muhammad, and His Religion, New York: The Liberal Arts Press, 1958, p. 85)>>>.
<<<"The word "Allah" comes from the compound Arabic word, al-ilah. Al is the definite article "the" and ilah is an Arabic word for "god." It is not a foreign word. It is not even the Syriac word for God. It is pure Arabic. [source - "Arabic Lexicographical Miscellanies" by J. Blau in the Journal of Semitic Studies, Vol. XVII, #2, 1972, pp. 173-190]>>>.
<<<"Neither is Allah a Hebrew or Greek word for God as found in the Bible. Allah is a purely Arabic term used in reference to an Arabian deity." [source - Hastings' Encyclopedia of Religion and Ethics I:326, T & T Clark]>>>. This historical reference book goes on to state, '"Allah" is a proper name, applicable only to their [Arabs'] peculiar God. '"
<<<"Allah" is a pre-Islamic name . . . corresponding to the Babylonian Bel' [source - Encyclopedia of Religion, I:117 Washington DC, Corpus Pub., 1979]>>>.
<<<"For those who find it hard to believe that Allah was a pagan name for a peculiar pagan Arabian deity in pre-Islamic times, the following quotations may be helpful:
"Allah is found . . . in Arabic inscriptions prior to Islam" [source - Encyclopedia Britannica, I:643]>>>.
<<<"The Arabs, before the time of Mohammed, accepted and worshipped, after a fashion, a supreme god called Allah" [source - Encyclopedia off Islam, I:302, Leiden: E.J. Brill, 1913, Houtsma]>>>.
<<<"Allah was known to the pre-Islamic . . . Arabs; he was one of the Meccan deities" [source - Encyclopedia off Islam, I:406, ed. Gibb]>>>.
<<<"Ilah . . . appears in pre-Islamic poetry . . . By frequency of usage, al-ilah was contracted to Allah, frequently attested to in pre-Islamic poetry" [source - Encyclopedia off Islam, III:1093, 1971][>>>.
<<<"The name Allah goes back before Muhammad" [source - Encyclopedia of World Mythology and Legend, I:41, Anthony Mercatante, New York, The Facts on File, 1983]>>>.
<<<"The origin of this (Allah) goes back to pre-Muslim times. Allah is not a common name meaning "God" (or a "god"), and the Muslim must use another word or form if he wishes to indicate any other than his own peculiar deity" [source - Encyclopedia of Religion and Ethics, I:326, Hastings]>>>.
<<<"Allah was already known by name to the Arabs" [source - The Bible and Islam: or, The Influence of the Old and New Testament on the Religion of Mohammed, New York, Charles Scribner's Sons, 1897, p. 102]>>>.
<<<"The name Allah is also evident in archeological and literary remains of pre-Islamic Arabia" [source - The Call of the Minaret, Dr. Kenneth Cragg, New York: Oxford University Press, 1956, p. 31]>>>.
So stop trying to deceive me and others. Allah is in NO WAY the true God (YHWH) of Abraham, Isaac, Ishmael, and Jacob, creator of all there is, but some other god. If you like, I can provide you pages more of proof with respect what I have just stated.
Joined: Nov 2006 Gender: Female Posts: 2,203 Karma: 1
Re: A Series of Facts on Contradictions in Quran « Reply #12 on Jul 3, 2007, 9:06am »
Hi inluvwitgod
STOP LYING, SEE WORK IN PROGRESS BELOW, YOU HAVE ONLY BEEN POSTING MOSTLY LIES AND/OR FALSE ACCUSATIONS AND THESE HAVE NO PLACE ON AN EDUCATIONAL FORUM:
MEMBERS OF ISLAM LIE AND POST MISS-INFORMATION COMPLETELY INAPPROPRIATE TO THE CONCEPT OF LEARNING AND EDUCATION:
Let’s look at some actual cases of lying and miss-information by members of Islam:
CASE 1:
What member of Islam said, with respect a Practice of a Horrible Heathen Crime Against Nature.
<<<”[[4]]How do you know true christians don't do this? Is there anything in your bible that forbids this practice? [[1]]What about for a girl who is deformed down there and has a need for this precedure? Is it wrong for her to have it as well? [[2]]Do you realize that women who live in very hot climates like Africa, experience swelling in that area, making this type of operation necessary for them to live a normal life? [[3]]I have never said that muslims around the world do not have cultural practices that have little or nothing to do with Islam.... it doesn't make it wrong or right based on that alone though.”>>>
Now let’s look past these lies and false accusations at the truth:
FIRST [[1]], There is no medical need for this procedure. The following article from an encyclopedia will clearly show this and the fact that it is bad for a women’s health. Saying there are medical reasons for same is nothing but AN OUTRIGHT LIE.
SECOND [[2]], Your saying that,
<<<”in very hot climates like Africa, experience swelling in that area, making this type of operation necessary for them to live a normal life?”>>>
Is AN OUTRIGHT LIE in no way backed by medical knowledge, see article below.
THIRD [[3]], You refuse to accept that many members of Islam practice this heathen horrible sex crime against young girls.
Is AN OUTRIGHT REJECTION OF REALITY which goes completely against the principles of education, learning, and the truth.
FOURTH [[4]], Genuine (true) followers do not practice this heathen horrible sex crime against young girls. The statement,
<<<” How do you know true christians don't do this? Is there anything in your bible that forbids this practice?”>>>
Is nothing but a deceptive question similar to the one used by Satan the Devil in the Garden of Eden, AN OUTRIGHT LIE in the form of a question.
FIFTH, LIES LIKE THIS ARE UN-EXCUSABLE, and show that any religion whose members resort to same are being controlled by Satan the Devil per John 8:44, “Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father it is your will to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and standeth not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father thereof.” (American Standard Version; ASV).
Islam is sick as shown by a terrible heathen sex crime against nature committed by many of their members in Egypt and elsewhere.
Members of Islam Practice Horrible Heathen Crime Against Nature. Now let’s look at just what this horrible crime against nature is:
Female genital cutting (FGC) refers to the excision or tissue removal of any part of the female genitalia for cultural, religious or other non-medical reasons. It is more frequently referred to as female genital mutilation (FGM) or female circumcision (FC). The term FGC does not refer to gender reassignment surgery or the genital modification of intersexuals.
Different terms are used to describe the act of female genital cutting, but regardless of the terminology the same practice is being referred to. Opponents of these practices tend to use the term Female Genital Mutilation (FGM), whereas groups who support and practice this ritual tend to use the term Female Circumcision (FC), which is also considered an euphemism. Advocates of male circumcision argue that the term "female circumcision" results in unwanted associations between the two practices, while genital integrity advocates might refer to all child genital cutting as mutilation. The expression Female Genital Mutilation gained growing support in the late 1970s. The word mutilation not only established clear linguistic distinction from male circumcision, but it also emphasized the gravity of the act. In 1990, this term was adopted at the third conference of the Inter African Committee on Traditional Practices Affecting the Health of Women and Children (IAC) in Addis Ababa. In 1991, the World Health Organization recommended that the United Nations adopt this terminology and subsequently, it has been widely used in UN documents. Amnesty International and the World Health Organization most often refer to the practice as 'Female Genital Mutilation'.[1][2][3][4] The use of the word mutilation reinforces the idea that this practice is a violation of the human rights of girls and women, and thereby helps promote national and international advocacy towards its abandonment. At the community level, however, the term can be problematic. Local languages generally use the less judgmental “cutting” to describe the practice; parents understandably resent the suggestion that they are “mutilating” their daughters. In this spirit, in 1999, the UN called for tact and patience regarding activities in this area and drew attention to the risk of “demonizing” certain cultures, religions and communities. As a result, the term “cutting” has increasingly come to be used to avoid alienating communities.[5] In 1996 the UNFPA-sponsored Reproductive, Educative, And Community Health program coined the term 'Female Genital Cutting', observing that 'Female Genital Mutilation' may "imply excessive judgment by outsiders as well as insensitivity toward individuals who have undergone some form of genital excision.[6]
There are several distinct practices of FGC that range in severity, depending on how much genital tissue is cut away. Four major types have been categorized (see Diagram 1), although there is some debate as to whether all common forms of FGC fit into these four categories, as well as issues with the reliability of reported data.[7]
Clitoridectomy involves the removal or splitting of the clitoral hood, termed "hoodectomy" (or "clitorodotomy"), with or without excision of the clitoris, see Diagram 1B. The clitoral hood is the female prepuce, homologous to the foreskin of the male. This term was devised in The Sudan by the Anglo-Sudanese administration in 1946 in an attempt to promote this "milder" form of FGC instead of the more severe Type III, infibulation or pharaonic circumcision, that was widely practiced.[8] Although labeled Sunna by Islamic advocates of the practice, most MusliType III is the most severe form of FGC and is called infibulation or pharaonic circumcision (referring to the Pharaohs who were thought to practice this form). Infibulation involves extensive tissue removal of the external genitalia, including all of the labia minora and the inside of the labia majora, leaving a raw open wound. The labia majora are then held together using thorns or stitching and the girl's legs are tied together for two - six weeks, to prevent her from moving and allow the healing of the two sides of the vulva. Nothing remains of the normal anatomy of the genitalia, except for a wall of flesh from the pubis down to the anus, with the exception of a pencil-size opening at the inferior portion of the vulva to allow urine and menstrual blood to pass through, see Diagram 1D. This type of FGC is often carried out by an elderly matron or midwife of the village on girls between the ages of two and six, without anaesthetic and under unhygienic conditions.[11] A reverse infibulation can be performed to allow for sexual intercourse (often by the husband using a knife on the wedding night) or when undergoing labor, or by female relatives, whose responsibility it is to inspect the wound every few weeks and open it some more if necessary. During childbirth, the enlargement is too small to allow girl thingyl delivery, and so the infibulation must be opened completely and restored after delivery. Once again, the legs are tied together to allow the wound to heal, and the procedure is repeated for each subsequent act of intercourse or childbirth. When childbirth takes place in a hospital, the surgeons may preserve the infibulation by enlarging the girl thingy with deep episiotomies. Afterwards, the patient may insist that her vulva be closed again so that her husband does not reject her.[11] This practice is reported to cause the disappearance of sexual pleasure for the women affected, as well as major medical complications. Most advocates of the practice continue to perform the procedure in adherence to standards of beauty that are very different from those in the west. Many infibulated women will contend that the pleasure their partners receive due to this procedure is a definitive part of a successful marriage. m clergy oppose all forms of female genital cutting as it is viewed as a social custom, rather than a religious practice. According to Dr. Sami A. Aldeeb Abu-Salieh at the Swiss Institute of Comparative Law:
Excision refers to clitoridectomy (removal of the prepuce and the clitoris) plus the partial or total removal of the labia minora, the inner lips of the vulva, see Diagram 1C. Type II circumcision is a more extensive form of FGC compared to Type I and due to the sewing together of the leftover labia minora epidermis, which contains sweat glands, a buildup of sweat and urine in the closed off space beneath this closure can lead to local or urinary infection, septicemia, hemorrhaging and cyst formation.[10] This type of FGC is also called khafd, meaning reduction in Arabic.
Female genital cutting is today mainly practiced in African countries. It is common in a band that stretches from Senegal in West Africa to Somalia on the East coast, as well as from Egypt (Who have just banned FGC[12]) in the north to Tanzania in the south, see Map. In these regions, it is estimated that more than 95% of all women have undergone this procedure. It is also practiced by some groups in the Arabian peninsula, especially among a minority (20%) in Yemen.[13] The countries that practice FGC the most are Somalia, followed by Egypt, Sudan, Ethiopia, and Mali. Among ethnic Somali women, infibulation is traditional and nearly universal. In the Arab peninsula, Sunna circumcision is usually performed, especially among Arabs (ethnic groups of African descent are more likely to prefer infibulation). Whilst FGC is widely practiced out in the open by African Muslims, it is practiced in secrecy in some parts of the Middle East. The practice occurs particularly in northern Saudi Arabia, southern Jordan, and Iraq, and there is also circumstantial evidence to suggest it is present in Syria, western Iran and southern Turkey.[14] In Oman a few communities still practice FGC; however, experts believed that the number of such cases was small and declining annually. In the United Arab Emirates and also Saudi Arabia, it is practiced mainly among foreign workers from East Africa and the Nile Valley. The practice can also be found among a few ethnic groups in South America and India. In Indonesia[15] the practice is fairly common among the country's Muslim women; however, in contrast to Africa, almost all are Type I or Type IV, the latter usually involving the symbolic pricking of blood release.
Due to immigration, the practice has also spread to Europe, Australia and the United States. Some tradition-minded families have their daughters undergo FGC whilst on vacation in their home countries. As Western governments become more aware of FGC, legislation has come into effect in many countries to make the practice of FGC a criminal offense. In 2006, Khalid Adem became the first man in the United States to be prosecuted for mutilating his daughter. Medical consequences Among practicing cultures, FGC is most commonly performed between the ages of four and eight, but can take place at any age from infancy to adolescence. Prohibition has led to FGC going underground, at times with people who have had no medical training performing the cutting without anesthetic, sterilization, or the use of proper medical instruments. The procedure, when performed without any anesthetic, can lead to death through shock from immense pain or excessive bleeding. The failure to use sterile medical instruments may lead to infections and the spread of disease, such as HIV, especially when the same instruments are used to perform procedures on multiple women.[10] Other serious long term health effects are also common. These include urinary and reproductive tract infections, caused by obstructed flow of urine and menstrual blood, various forms of scarring and infertility. The first time having sexual intercourse will often be extremely painful, and infibulated women will need the labia majora to be opened, to allow their husband access to the girl thingy. This second cut, sometimes performed by the husband with a knife, can cause other complications to arise. The health consequences of FGC vary from region to region and from researcher to researcher. An in-depth analysis by Carla Obermeyer (2003) shows that past studies, plagued by “incomplete analysis” and “inconsistent numbers”, have greatly overestimated the likelihood of serious medical complications resulting from FGC procedures (401). She notes that there is no significant statistically represented relationship between FGC and sexually transmitted diseases/infections, infertility or birth complications (402). Her study illustrates how the opposers of FGC may be relying on inadequate health data to justify their opposition, and instead more meaningful and relevant medical research needs to be conducted in order to help support the cessation of this practice. A June 2006 study by the WHO has cast doubt on the safety of genital cutting of any kind.[29] This study was conducted on a cohort of 28,393 women attending delivery wards at 28 obstetric centers in areas of Burkina Faso, Ghana, Nigeria, Kenya, Senegal and The Sudan. A high proportion of these mothers had undergone FGC. According to the WHO criteria, all types of FGC were found to pose an increased risk of death to the baby (15% for Type I, 32% for Type II, and 55% for Type III). Mothers with FGC Type III were also found to be 30% more at risk for cesarean sections and had a 70% increase in postpartum hemorrhage compared to women without FGC. Estimating from these results, and doing a rough population estimate of mothers in Africa with FGC, an additional 10 to 20 per thousand babies in Africa die during delivery as a result of the mothers having undergone genital cutting. In cases of repairing the damage resulting from FGC, called de-infibulation when reversing Type III FGC, this is usually carried out by a gynecologist. See also Pierre Foldes, French surgeon, who developed modern surgical corrective techniques. A 12 year-old Egyptian girl, Badour Shaker, died in June, 2007 during or soon after a circumcision. She died from an overdose of anesthesia. The girl's mother, Zeniab Abdel Ghani, paid $9.00 [or 5 British pounds] to a female doctor, in an illegal clinic in the southern town of Maghagh, for the operation. The doctor tried to give her $3,000 to withdraw a lawsuit, but the mother refused.[source - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia]
CASE 2:
Falsely claiming a homosexual web site briefly mentioned in a post on homosexuality and making a big thing out of nothing is a form of lying.
Let’s look first at what was said, <<<” I never back things that Almighty God (YHWH) disapproves of like gay marriages, the acceptance of gay men, and lesbians such as Bishop Fred Hiltz of Nova Scotia and Prince Edward Island does. You should well know that these things violate Romans 1:21-27, "because that, knowing God, they glorified him not as God, neither gave thanks; but became vain in their reasonings, and their senseless heart was darkened. 22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, 23 and changed the glory of the incorruptible God for the likeness of an image of corruptible man, and of birds, and four-footed beasts, and creeping things. 24 Wherefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts unto uncleanness, that their bodies should be dishonored among themselves: 25 for that they exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshipped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen. 26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile passions: for their women changed the natural use into that which is against nature: 27 and likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another, men with men working unseemliness, and receiving in themselves that recompense of their error which was due." (ASV). Nor do I agree with the Muslims at GayEgypt of which the "The Middle East Times" says "GayEgypt.com has emerged as a key source of information and communication for the gay community in Egypt." It's a shame that the Muslim community as well as the apostate (counterfeit) Christian community tolerate such wrong doing.”>>>
Clearly shows that homosexuality was being addressing, a wrong, per Romans 1:19-28, “because that which is known of God is manifest in them; for God manifested it unto them. 20 For the invisible things of him since the creation of the world are clearly seen, being perceived through the things that are made, even his everlasting power and divinity; that they may be without excuse: 21 because that, knowing God, they glorified him not as God, neither gave thanks; but became vain in their reasonings, and their senseless heart was darkened. 22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, 23 and changed the glory of the incorruptible God for the likeness of an image of corruptible man, and of birds, and four–footed beasts, and creeping things. 24 Wherefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts unto uncleanness, that their bodies should be dishonored among themselves: 25 for that they exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshipped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen. 26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile passions: for their women changed the natural use into that which is against nature. 27 and likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another, men with men working unseemliness, and receiving in themselves that recompense of their error which was due. 28 And even as they refused to have God in their knowledge, God gave them up unto a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not fitting;” :” (ASV), but just to distort reality the posting of this item against homosexuality brought the following lying false accusation.
<<<”Porn site on a religious form? Why?”>>>.
This is AN OUTRIGHT LIE as are all false accusations.
First, let’s consider what porn is:
"PORN, noun: creative activity (writing or pictures or films etc.) of no literary or artistic value other than to stimulate sexual desire [source - One Look Dictionary, http://www.onelook.com/?w=porn&ls=a ]"
"Pornography, sometimes shortened to porn or porno, is, in its broadest state, the explicit representation of the human body or sexual activity with the goal of sexual arousal and/or sexual relief. It is similar to erotica, which is the use of sexually-arousing imagery used mainly for artistic purpose. Over the past few decades, an immense industry for the production and consumption of pornography has grown, due to emergence of the VCR, the DVD, and the Internet, as well as the emergence of more tolerant social attitudes.
In general, "erotica" refers to portrayals of sexually arousing material that hold or aspire to artistic or historical merit, whereas "pornography" often connotes the prurient depiction of sexual acts, with little or no artistic value. The line between "erotica" and the term "pornography" (which is frequently considered a pejorative term) is often highly subjective. In practice, pornography can be defined merely as erotica that certain people perceive as "obscene." The definition of what one considers obscene can differ between persons, cultures and eras. This leaves legal actions by those who oppose pornography open to wide interpretation. It also provides lucrative employment for armies of lawyers, on several "sides." Pornography may use any of a variety of media - printed literature, photos, sculpture, drawing, painting, animation, sound recording, film, video, or video game. However, when sexual acts are performed for a live audience, by definition it is not pornography, as the term applies to the depiction or reproduction of the act, rather than the act itself.[source - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pornography ]"
Obviously the mention of a homosexual site with respect its wrong is definitely not a portrayal of anything to arouse “erotic” responses in any one. So the accusation was nothing but AN OUTRIGHT LIE.
Second, No where on the GayEgypt site was there any “erotic” material, and the “roughest” item was only an obviously Arab man with a bare but not in any “erotic” pose that would qualify as porn. Everything was much more tame than many beaches in France.
Third, Here is what others said of the site – clearly identifying it as a homosexual site being run by members of Islam and not a porn site:
[1] Global Gayz...Gay Egypt Today, there is only one site -- www.gayegypt.com -- left, and it is run from ... Being gay and Muslim is another conundrum for most Egyptian homosexuals. ... www.globalgayz.com/g-egypt2.html - 69k - Cached - Similar pages
[2] [PDF] Internet Filtering in Iran in 2004-2005 1 File Format: PDF/Adobe Acrobat - View as HTML Our first run of testing found blocking of 39% of sex education sites, compared with ... gayegypt.com, gay.ru, and gaytoday.badpuppy.com) as ... [source - www.cambridge-security.net/pdf/ONI-iran-country-study.pdf]
[3] Cultural Struggle Finds Symbol in Gay Cairo Internet sites such as GayEgypt.com had taken to describing "handsome youths" ... Gay Muslim groups in several countries have established support groups and ... [source - www.sodomylaws.org/world/egypt/egnews49.htm]
[4] FEBRUARY 2002 - FRENCH PRESIDENT CHIRAC DENOUNCES EGYPT'S GAY ... Already GayEgypt.com and its' satellite site Arab-Men.com are spreading the .... it was alleged that they had run an apartment for homosexual prostitution. ... [source - www.gayegypt.com/january2002.html]
[5] Dissecting Leftism -- Large font site Muslim against Muslim: "The latest reliable report confirms that on ...... of Terror," while the website GayEgypt.com has dubbed him the "Dr. Goebbels of ... [source - jonjayray.blogspot.com/2005_07_01_archive.html]
[6] Prisoners of Sex "When a Muslim dies, there is a required 30 minutes of prayer," she wrote to ... A Web site called GayEgypt.com called on Egypt's homosexuals to wear red on ... [source - www.whrnet.org/fundamentalisms/docs/issue-prisoners-0612.html]
[7] Popular Pakistani Cross-dresser Pushing Boundaries [Archive ... - [ Translate this page ] Do you or others, specially our Muslim members, would like to find out if this behavior is .... Again, they run this site, they deserve to decide. ... [source - sci.rutgers.edu/forum/archive/index.php/t-63125.html
[[Notice all those sites mention “gay” the euphemism for homosexual, not porn.]]
Fourth, Email from GayEgypt site administrator:
<<<”Many thanks for your email. re GayEgypt.com it's in large part an information site but it contains a very few photographs and a few stories which might be described as pornographic, certainly it's a website for adults 18+ only.
It is unquestionably a site run by members of Islam as who else would be concerned about what the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) did that might be considered “gay”, but Muslim “gays.”
Falsely accusing one writing against homosexuality of posting porn when what was posted was a homosexual site quite in keeping with what was being written about. Of course the accusation is NOTHING BUT AN OUTRIGHT LIE.
Why do members of Islam so lie? Simple, to cover up the salient fact that members of Islam are running one of the largest homosexual sites in the world – they can not stand the truth, but must un-justly denounce the messenger or bringer of fact.
Joined: Nov 2006 Gender: Female Posts: 2,203 Karma: 1
Re: A Series of Facts on Contradictions in Quran « Reply #13 on Jul 3, 2007, 12:05pm »
Hi inluvwitgod
I delete post that are lies, false accusations, personal attacks, or other items either in the wrong place such as the announcement thread, or have absolutely no place on a forum whose purpose is to educate and not to mislead. I have warned you on this in the past, and I do not plan to spend all day showing that your dumb post are just plain wrong and untrue. To keep posting lies, false accusations, personal attacks etc. is an abuse of both this educational forum and my time and will not be permitted, this crap is insulting and in no way educational any more than Nazi propaganda. See below:
ABOVE ALL STOP LYING AND MAKING FALSE ACCUSATIONS – SEE WORK IN PROGRESS BELOW:
MEMBERS OF ISLAM LIE AND POST MISS-INFORMATION COMPLETELY INAPPROPRIATE TO THE CONCEPT OF LEARNING AND EDUCATION:
Let’s look at some actual cases of lying and miss-information by members of Islam:
CASE 1:
What member of Islam said, with respect a Practice of a Horrible Heathen Crime Against Nature.
<<<”[[4]]How do you know true christians don't do this? Is there anything in your bible that forbids this practice? [[1]]What about for a girl who is deformed down there and has a need for this precedure? Is it wrong for her to have it as well? [[2]]Do you realize that women who live in very hot climates like Africa, experience swelling in that area, making this type of operation necessary for them to live a normal life? [[3]]I have never said that muslims around the world do not have cultural practices that have little or nothing to do with Islam.... it doesn't make it wrong or right based on that alone though.”>>>
Now let’s look past these lies and false accusations at the truth:
FIRST [[1]], There is no medical need for this procedure. The following article from an encyclopedia will clearly show this and the fact that it is bad for a women’s health. Saying there are medical reasons for same is nothing but AN OUTRIGHT LIE.
SECOND [[2]], Your saying that,
<<<”in very hot climates like Africa, experience swelling in that area, making this type of operation necessary for them to live a normal life?”>>>
Is AN OUTRIGHT LIE in no way backed by medical knowledge, see article below.
THIRD [[3]], You refuse to accept that many members of Islam practice this heathen horrible sex crime against young girls.
Is AN OUTRIGHT REJECTION OF REALITY which goes completely against the principles of education, learning, and the truth.
FOURTH [[4]], Genuine (true) followers do not practice this heathen horrible sex crime against young girls. The statement,
<<<” How do you know true christians don't do this? Is there anything in your bible that forbids this practice?”>>>
Is nothing but a deceptive question similar to the one used by Satan the Devil in the Garden of Eden, AN OUTRIGHT LIE in the form of a question.
FIFTH, LIES LIKE THIS ARE UN-EXCUSABLE, and show that any religion whose members resort to same are being controlled by Satan the Devil per John 8:44, “Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father it is your will to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and standeth not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father thereof.” (American Standard Version; ASV).
Islam is sick as shown by a terrible heathen sex crime against nature committed by many of their members in Egypt and elsewhere.
Members of Islam Practice Horrible Heathen Crime Against Nature. Now let’s look at just what this horrible crime against nature is:
Female genital cutting (FGC) refers to the excision or tissue removal of any part of the female genitalia for cultural, religious or other non-medical reasons. It is more frequently referred to as female genital mutilation (FGM) or female circumcision (FC). The term FGC does not refer to gender reassignment surgery or the genital modification of intersexuals.
Different terms are used to describe the act of female genital cutting, but regardless of the terminology the same practice is being referred to. Opponents of these practices tend to use the term Female Genital Mutilation (FGM), whereas groups who support and practice this ritual tend to use the term Female Circumcision (FC), which is also considered an euphemism. Advocates of male circumcision argue that the term "female circumcision" results in unwanted associations between the two practices, while genital integrity advocates might refer to all child genital cutting as mutilation. The expression Female Genital Mutilation gained growing support in the late 1970s. The word mutilation not only established clear linguistic distinction from male circumcision, but it also emphasized the gravity of the act. In 1990, this term was adopted at the third conference of the Inter African Committee on Traditional Practices Affecting the Health of Women and Children (IAC) in Addis Ababa. In 1991, the World Health Organization recommended that the United Nations adopt this terminology and subsequently, it has been widely used in UN documents. Amnesty International and the World Health Organization most often refer to the practice as 'Female Genital Mutilation'.[1][2][3][4] The use of the word mutilation reinforces the idea that this practice is a violation of the human rights of girls and women, and thereby helps promote national and international advocacy towards its abandonment. At the community level, however, the term can be problematic. Local languages generally use the less judgmental “cutting” to describe the practice; parents understandably resent the suggestion that they are “mutilating” their daughters. In this spirit, in 1999, the UN called for tact and patience regarding activities in this area and drew attention to the risk of “demonizing” certain cultures, religions and communities. As a result, the term “cutting” has increasingly come to be used to avoid alienating communities.[5] In 1996 the UNFPA-sponsored Reproductive, Educative, And Community Health program coined the term 'Female Genital Cutting', observing that 'Female Genital Mutilation' may "imply excessive judgment by outsiders as well as insensitivity toward individuals who have undergone some form of genital excision.[6]
There are several distinct practices of FGC that range in severity, depending on how much genital tissue is cut away. Four major types have been categorized (see Diagram 1), although there is some debate as to whether all common forms of FGC fit into these four categories, as well as issues with the reliability of reported data.[7]
Clitoridectomy involves the removal or splitting of the clitoral hood, termed "hoodectomy" (or "clitorodotomy"), with or without excision of the clitoris, see Diagram 1B. The clitoral hood is the female prepuce, homologous to the foreskin of the male. This term was devised in The Sudan by the Anglo-Sudanese administration in 1946 in an attempt to promote this "milder" form of FGC instead of the more severe Type III, infibulation or pharaonic circumcision, that was widely practiced.[8] Although labeled Sunna by Islamic advocates of the practice, most MusliType III is the most severe form of FGC and is called infibulation or pharaonic circumcision (referring to the Pharaohs who were thought to practice this form). Infibulation involves extensive tissue removal of the external genitalia, including all of the labia minora and the inside of the labia majora, leaving a raw open wound. The labia majora are then held together using thorns or stitching and the girl's legs are tied together for two - six weeks, to prevent her from moving and allow the healing of the two sides of the vulva. Nothing remains of the normal anatomy of the genitalia, except for a wall of flesh from the pubis down to the anus, with the exception of a pencil-size opening at the inferior portion of the vulva to allow urine and menstrual blood to pass through, see Diagram 1D. This type of FGC is often carried out by an elderly matron or midwife of the village on girls between the ages of two and six, without anaesthetic and under unhygienic conditions.[11] A reverse infibulation can be performed to allow for sexual intercourse (often by the husband using a knife on the wedding night) or when undergoing labor, or by female relatives, whose responsibility it is to inspect the wound every few weeks and open it some more if necessary. During childbirth, the enlargement is too small to allow girl thingyl delivery, and so the infibulation must be opened completely and restored after delivery. Once again, the legs are tied together to allow the wound to heal, and the procedure is repeated for each subsequent act of intercourse or childbirth. When childbirth takes place in a hospital, the surgeons may preserve the infibulation by enlarging the girl thingy with deep episiotomies. Afterwards, the patient may insist that her vulva be closed again so that her husband does not reject her.[11] This practice is reported to cause the disappearance of sexual pleasure for the women affected, as well as major medical complications. Most advocates of the practice continue to perform the procedure in adherence to standards of beauty that are very different from those in the west. Many infibulated women will contend that the pleasure their partners receive due to this procedure is a definitive part of a successful marriage. m clergy oppose all forms of female genital cutting as it is viewed as a social custom, rather than a religious practice. According to Dr. Sami A. Aldeeb Abu-Salieh at the Swiss Institute of Comparative Law:
Excision refers to clitoridectomy (removal of the prepuce and the clitoris) plus the partial or total removal of the labia minora, the inner lips of the vulva, see Diagram 1C. Type II circumcision is a more extensive form of FGC compared to Type I and due to the sewing together of the leftover labia minora epidermis, which contains sweat glands, a buildup of sweat and urine in the closed off space beneath this closure can lead to local or urinary infection, septicemia, hemorrhaging and cyst formation.[10] This type of FGC is also called khafd, meaning reduction in Arabic.
Female genital cutting is today mainly practiced in African countries. It is common in a band that stretches from Senegal in West Africa to Somalia on the East coast, as well as from Egypt (Who have just banned FGC[12]) in the north to Tanzania in the south, see Map. In these regions, it is estimated that more than 95% of all women have undergone this procedure. It is also practiced by some groups in the Arabian peninsula, especially among a minority (20%) in Yemen.[13] The countries that practice FGC the most are Somalia, followed by Egypt, Sudan, Ethiopia, and Mali. Among ethnic Somali women, infibulation is traditional and nearly universal. In the Arab peninsula, Sunna circumcision is usually performed, especially among Arabs (ethnic groups of African descent are more likely to prefer infibulation). Whilst FGC is widely practiced out in the open by African Muslims, it is practiced in secrecy in some parts of the Middle East. The practice occurs particularly in northern Saudi Arabia, southern Jordan, and Iraq, and there is also circumstantial evidence to suggest it is present in Syria, western Iran and southern Turkey.[14] In Oman a few communities still practice FGC; however, experts believed that the number of such cases was small and declining annually. In the United Arab Emirates and also Saudi Arabia, it is practiced mainly among foreign workers from East Africa and the Nile Valley. The practice can also be found among a few ethnic groups in South America and India. In Indonesia[15] the practice is fairly common among the country's Muslim women; however, in contrast to Africa, almost all are Type I or Type IV, the latter usually involving the symbolic pricking of blood release.
Due to immigration, the practice has also spread to Europe, Australia and the United States. Some tradition-minded families have their daughters undergo FGC whilst on vacation in their home countries. As Western governments become more aware of FGC, legislation has come into effect in many countries to make the practice of FGC a criminal offense. In 2006, Khalid Adem became the first man in the United States to be prosecuted for mutilating his daughter. Medical consequences Among practicing cultures, FGC is most commonly performed between the ages of four and eight, but can take place at any age from infancy to adolescence. Prohibition has led to FGC going underground, at times with people who have had no medical training performing the cutting without anesthetic, sterilization, or the use of proper medical instruments. The procedure, when performed without any anesthetic, can lead to death through shock from immense pain or excessive bleeding. The failure to use sterile medical instruments may lead to infections and the spread of disease, such as HIV, especially when the same instruments are used to perform procedures on multiple women.[10] Other serious long term health effects are also common. These include urinary and reproductive tract infections, caused by obstructed flow of urine and menstrual blood, various forms of scarring and infertility. The first time having sexual intercourse will often be extremely painful, and infibulated women will need the labia majora to be opened, to allow their husband access to the girl thingy. This second cut, sometimes performed by the husband with a knife, can cause other complications to arise. The health consequences of FGC vary from region to region and from researcher to researcher. An in-depth analysis by Carla Obermeyer (2003) shows that past studies, plagued by “incomplete analysis” and “inconsistent numbers”, have greatly overestimated the likelihood of serious medical complications resulting from FGC procedures (401). She notes that there is no significant statistically represented relationship between FGC and sexually transmitted diseases/infections, infertility or birth complications (402). Her study illustrates how the opposers of FGC may be relying on inadequate health data to justify their opposition, and instead more meaningful and relevant medical research needs to be conducted in order to help support the cessation of this practice. A June 2006 study by the WHO has cast doubt on the safety of genital cutting of any kind.[29] This study was conducted on a cohort of 28,393 women attending delivery wards at 28 obstetric centers in areas of Burkina Faso, Ghana, Nigeria, Kenya, Senegal and The Sudan. A high proportion of these mothers had undergone FGC. According to the WHO criteria, all types of FGC were found to pose an increased risk of death to the baby (15% for Type I, 32% for Type II, and 55% for Type III). Mothers with FGC Type III were also found to be 30% more at risk for cesarean sections and had a 70% increase in postpartum hemorrhage compared to women without FGC. Estimating from these results, and doing a rough population estimate of mothers in Africa with FGC, an additional 10 to 20 per thousand babies in Africa die during delivery as a result of the mothers having undergone genital cutting. In cases of repairing the damage resulting from FGC, called de-infibulation when reversing Type III FGC, this is usually carried out by a gynecologist. See also Pierre Foldes, French surgeon, who developed modern surgical corrective techniques. A 12 year-old Egyptian girl, Badour Shaker, died in June, 2007 during or soon after a circumcision. She died from an overdose of anesthesia. The girl's mother, Zeniab Abdel Ghani, paid $9.00 [or 5 British pounds] to a female doctor, in an illegal clinic in the southern town of Maghagh, for the operation. The doctor tried to give her $3,000 to withdraw a lawsuit, but the mother refused.[source - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia]
CASE 2:
Falsely claiming a homosexual web site briefly mentioned in a post on homosexuality and making a big thing out of nothing is a form of lying.
Let’s look first at what was said, <<<” I never back things that Almighty God (YHWH) disapproves of like gay marriages, the acceptance of gay men, and lesbians such as Bishop Fred Hiltz of Nova Scotia and Prince Edward Island does. You should well know that these things violate Romans 1:21-27, "because that, knowing God, they glorified him not as God, neither gave thanks; but became vain in their reasonings, and their senseless heart was darkened. 22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, 23 and changed the glory of the incorruptible God for the likeness of an image of corruptible man, and of birds, and four-footed beasts, and creeping things. 24 Wherefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts unto uncleanness, that their bodies should be dishonored among themselves: 25 for that they exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshipped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen. 26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile passions: for their women changed the natural use into that which is against nature: 27 and likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another, men with men working unseemliness, and receiving in themselves that recompense of their error which was due." (ASV). Nor do I agree with the Muslims at GayEgypt of which the "The Middle East Times" says "GayEgypt.com has emerged as a key source of information and communication for the gay community in Egypt." It's a shame that the Muslim community as well as the apostate (counterfeit) Christian community tolerate such wrong doing.”>>>
Clearly shows that homosexuality was being addressing, a wrong, per Romans 1:19-28, “because that which is known of God is manifest in them; for God manifested it unto them. 20 For the invisible things of him since the creation of the world are clearly seen, being perceived through the things that are made, even his everlasting power and divinity; that they may be without excuse: 21 because that, knowing God, they glorified him not as God, neither gave thanks; but became vain in their reasonings, and their senseless heart was darkened. 22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, 23 and changed the glory of the incorruptible God for the likeness of an image of corruptible man, and of birds, and four–footed beasts, and creeping things. 24 Wherefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts unto uncleanness, that their bodies should be dishonored among themselves: 25 for that they exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshipped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen. 26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile passions: for their women changed the natural use into that which is against nature. 27 and likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another, men with men working unseemliness, and receiving in themselves that recompense of their error which was due. 28 And even as they refused to have God in their knowledge, God gave them up unto a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not fitting;” :” (ASV), but just to distort reality the posting of this item against homosexuality brought the following lying false accusation.
<<<”Porn site on a religious form? Why?”>>>.
This is AN OUTRIGHT LIE as are all false accusations.
First, let’s consider what porn is:
"PORN, noun: creative activity (writing or pictures or films etc.) of no literary or artistic value other than to stimulate sexual desire [source - One Look Dictionary, http://www.onelook.com/?w=porn&ls=a ]"
"Pornography, sometimes shortened to porn or porno, is, in its broadest state, the explicit representation of the human body or sexual activity with the goal of sexual arousal and/or sexual relief. It is similar to erotica, which is the use of sexually-arousing imagery used mainly for artistic purpose. Over the past few decades, an immense industry for the production and consumption of pornography has grown, due to emergence of the VCR, the DVD, and the Internet, as well as the emergence of more tolerant social attitudes.
In general, "erotica" refers to portrayals of sexually arousing material that hold or aspire to artistic or historical merit, whereas "pornography" often connotes the prurient depiction of sexual acts, with little or no artistic value. The line between "erotica" and the term "pornography" (which is frequently considered a pejorative term) is often highly subjective. In practice, pornography can be defined merely as erotica that certain people perceive as "obscene." The definition of what one considers obscene can differ between persons, cultures and eras. This leaves legal actions by those who oppose pornography open to wide interpretation. It also provides lucrative employment for armies of lawyers, on several "sides." Pornography may use any of a variety of media - printed literature, photos, sculpture, drawing, painting, animation, sound recording, film, video, or video game. However, when sexual acts are performed for a live audience, by definition it is not pornography, as the term applies to the depiction or reproduction of the act, rather than the act itself.[source - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pornography ]"
Obviously the mention of a homosexual site with respect its wrong is definitely not a portrayal of anything to arouse “erotic” responses in any one. So the accusation was nothing but AN OUTRIGHT LIE.
Second, No where on the GayEgypt site was there any “erotic” material, and the “roughest” item was only an obviously Arab man with a bare but not in any “erotic” pose that would qualify as porn. Everything was much more tame than many beaches in France.
Third, Here is what others said of the site – clearly identifying it as a homosexual site being run by members of Islam and not a porn site:
[1] Global Gayz...Gay Egypt Today, there is only one site -- www.gayegypt.com -- left, and it is run from ... Being gay and Muslim is another conundrum for most Egyptian homosexuals. ... www.globalgayz.com/g-egypt2.html - 69k - Cached - Similar pages
[2] [PDF] Internet Filtering in Iran in 2004-2005 1 File Format: PDF/Adobe Acrobat - View as HTML Our first run of testing found blocking of 39% of sex education sites, compared with ... gayegypt.com, gay.ru, and gaytoday.badpuppy.com) as ... [source - www.cambridge-security.net/pdf/ONI-iran-country-study.pdf]
[3] Cultural Struggle Finds Symbol in Gay Cairo Internet sites such as GayEgypt.com had taken to describing "handsome youths" ... Gay Muslim groups in several countries have established support groups and ... [source - www.sodomylaws.org/world/egypt/egnews49.htm]
[4] FEBRUARY 2002 - FRENCH PRESIDENT CHIRAC DENOUNCES EGYPT'S GAY ... Already GayEgypt.com and its' satellite site Arab-Men.com are spreading the .... it was alleged that they had run an apartment for homosexual prostitution. ... [source - www.gayegypt.com/january2002.html]
[5] Dissecting Leftism -- Large font site Muslim against Muslim: "The latest reliable report confirms that on ...... of Terror," while the website GayEgypt.com has dubbed him the "Dr. Goebbels of ... [source - jonjayray.blogspot.com/2005_07_01_archive.html]
[6] Prisoners of Sex "When a Muslim dies, there is a required 30 minutes of prayer," she wrote to ... A Web site called GayEgypt.com called on Egypt's homosexuals to wear red on ... [source - www.whrnet.org/fundamentalisms/docs/issue-prisoners-0612.html]
[7] Popular Pakistani Cross-dresser Pushing Boundaries [Archive ... - [ Translate this page ] Do you or others, specially our Muslim members, would like to find out if this behavior is .... Again, they run this site, they deserve to decide. ... [source - sci.rutgers.edu/forum/archive/index.php/t-63125.html
[[Notice all those sites mention “gay” the euphemism for homosexual, not porn.]]
Fourth, Email from GayEgypt site administrator:
<<<”Many thanks for your email. re GayEgypt.com it's in large part an information site but it contains a very few photographs and a few stories which might be described as pornographic, certainly it's a website for adults 18+ only.
It is unquestionably a site run by members of Islam as who else would be concerned about what the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) did that might be considered “gay”, but Muslim “gays.”
Falsely accusing one writing against homosexuality of posting porn when what was posted was a homosexual site quite in keeping with what was being written about. Of course the accusation is NOTHING BUT AN OUTRIGHT LIE.
Joined: Nov 2006 Gender: Female Posts: 2,203 Karma: 1
Re: A Series of Facts on Contradictions in Quran « Reply #14 on Jul 3, 2007, 12:06pm »
Page Two Of Why Abusive Post Deleted:
Why do members of Islam so lie? Simple, to cover up the salient fact that members of Islam are running one of the largest homosexual sites in the world – they can not stand the truth, but must un-justly denounce the messenger or bringer of fact.
CASE 3: This poster said the following lie,
<<<”I do not lie Iris and it's not very loving of you to continously insist that I would knowingly pass on false information as a liar.>>>”
We have already seen that he tells OUTRAGEOUS LIES in CASE 1 and CASE 2, so this statement is just an OUTRIGHT LIE ITSELF.
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